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This debate has united the House in expressing concern for these glorious buildings. There might be slight differences of opinion as to which is top of the list but that matters not a jot. We are talking about some of the most glorious buildings not only in this country or Europe but in the world. I derived some comfort when the Minister said that she wanted to ensure that they were safeguarded as well as enjoyed. Grateful as we all are for what she said, I hope that she will reinforce the request for the £50 million endowment. It is a very tiny sum in the national budget, as others indicated. I very much hope that something will come of that. The sums we are talking of are small.
One of the recurring themes of the debate was the wonderful contribution of choral music and the crucial importance of maintaining that tradition, which means so much to us all. When I go to Lincoln for choral evensong, as I do every day when I am there, I come away feeling inspired, refreshed and invigorated by what I have heard, and by the solemnity of the surroundings in which the glorious music took place. I feel the same on a Sunday morning after sung matins. I am delighted by the good Prayer Book services in Lincoln. I thank all noble Lords for what they said in the debate and am most grateful to them for underlining the importance of this glorious built heritage of ours.
"Mr Speaker, I would like to update the House on the Financial Services Authority's investigation into the manipulation of the setting of the LIBOR and EURIBOR interest rates and the Government's response.
The London Interbank Offered Rate or 'LIBOR' and the Euro Interbank Offered Rate or 'EURIBOR' are the benchmark reference rates that are fundamental to the workings of the UK, European and international financial markets, including markets in interest rate derivatives contracts. These contracts may sound exotic, but they are the bread and butter of our financial system and are used by businesses and public authorities every day, and they affect the mortgage payments and loan rates of millions of families and hundreds of thousands of firms, large and small. LIBOR and EURIBOR are by far the most prevalent benchmark reference rates used in euro, US dollar and sterling interest rate derivatives contracts. The outstanding interest rate contracts alone are estimated to be worth $554 trillion.
Yesterday, the FSA published notice that Barclays had, on numerous occasions, acted inappropriately and breached principles 2, 3 and 5 of the FSA's Principles for Businesses. As a result, the FSA has imposed a financial penalty of £59.5 million on Barclays. In other words, the FSA reports that this bank, on numerous occasions, did not conduct its business with due skill, care and diligence. The bank did not take reasonable care to organise its affairs responsibly and effectively, with adequate risk management systems, and it did not observe proper standards of market conduct. As the FSA puts it,
'Barclays' misconduct ... created the risk that the integrity of LIBOR and EURIBOR would be called into question and that confidence in or the stability of the UK financial system would be threatened'.
Barclays is not alone in this. The FSA is continuing to investigate the conduct of a number of other banks in relation to LIBOR. The FSA continues to commit significant resources to its investigations into potential attempts to manipulate LIBOR, and it continues to work with its counterparts overseas and with other authorities in the UK. The investigations concern a number of institutions both based in the UK and overseas, but it is already clear that the FSA's investigation demonstrates systematic failures at the heart of the financial system at the time.
I want to thank Adair Turner and the team at the FSA for a very thorough piece of work. However, it begs three vital questions. First, how were such failures allowed to continue undetected and unchecked-particularly in the two years before the financial crisis, when the FSA is clear that the most serious breaches occurred, and the only motive was greed? Secondly, what changes are needed to our regulatory system in the future to prevent such abuse occurring again, and to make sure that the authorities have every power they need to hold those responsible fully to account? Thirdly, what further investigations are required into the activities at Barclays, what sanctions are available, and what questions must their chief executive answer?
First, the FSA report is a shocking indictment of the culture at banks like Barclays in the run up to the financial crisis. The e-mail exchanges between derivative traders and the LIBOR submitters read like an epitaph to an age of irresponsibility. Through 2005, 2006, and early 2007, we see evidence of systematic greed at the expense of financial integrity and stability. They knew that what they were doing was wrong: 'Keep a secret',
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The FSA is clear that the most serious breaches of its Principles for Businesses occurred in the years leading up to the financial crisis. Once the crisis is under way, Barclays' concern switches from the greed of traders to concern from the management about the reputational risk to the firm. Barclays itself raises concerns about the LIBOR with the FSA in late 2007 and 2008. Yes, the financial system was experiencing a severe stress, and markets were frozen. However, it is clear that Barclays-and potentially other banks-was still in flagrant breach of its duty to observe proper standards of market conduct and to give citizens and businesses in this country and elsewhere proper transparent information about the true price of money. Britain's tripartite system of regulation failed us in war and in peace-and the country has paid a heavy price for that.
That brings me to the second question of how we can prevent this from ever happening again. This Government are getting rid of the whole tripartite system. The Financial Services Bill now before Parliament will create a new, far tougher regulatory system. A new Financial Conduct Authority will focus, razor-like, on market abuse and protecting consumers. We have been reviewing with the FSA and the Bank of England the operation of the LIBOR regime-which was not regulated under the last Government's Financial Services and Markets Act. The market is already changing and the role of LIBOR is changing with it. As part of our review into LIBOR and the strength of the financial regulatory architecture, we will examine if there are any gaps in the criminal regime inherited by this Government and we will take the necessary steps to address them.
I cannot comment on possible criminal investigations for individuals involved in this activity. The authorities are exploring every avenue open to them, but shockingly, the scope of the FSA's criminal powers granted by the previous Government does not extend to being able to impose criminal sanctions for manipulation of LIBOR. As part of our review into LIBOR and the strength of the financial regulatory architecture, we are examining whether strengthening the criminal sanctions regime for market abuse and market manipulation is warranted, and if so, we will provide for these powers quickly. In addition, next week the Government will publish a consultation in response to the report on the failure of RBS, and will consider the possibility of criminal sanctions for directors of failed banks where there is proven criminal negligence.
Under the previous Government's regime, fines paid to the FSA are used to reduce the annual levy other financial institutions are asked to pay. I am far from convinced that in all cases this is the best use of the money. We are considering amendments to the Financial Services Bill that ensure that fines of this nature go to help the taxpaying public, not the financial industry. I have also asked my officials urgently to investigate
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As I say, a number of individuals are under formal investigation by the FSA, and this number is expected to increase as the investigations continue. The Serious Fraud Office is aware of the matters under investigation, and there are ongoing discussions between the FSA and the SFO about the evidence as it develops. As far as the chief executive of Barclays is concerned, he has some very serious questions to answer today. What did he know, and when did he know it? Who in the Barclays management is involved, and who, therefore, should pay the price? It is quite right that the Treasury Select Committee has asked him to appear urgently to account for himself and for his bank. We all want to hear his answers.
The story of irresponsibility is not over yet. Our financial services should be a source of economic strength and national pride for this country. However, failures in our banks and financial system have cost the country billions and put thousands out of work. Those responsible should be held responsible. We want our financial services to support the creation of jobs and prosperity for millions. This Government are sweeping away the regulatory system that failed. They will protect taxpayers, punish wrong-doing, and put right the wrongs of the age of irresponsibility."
Lord Tunnicliffe: My Lords, I thank the Minister for repeating the Statement made in the other place. I would like to open by saying a little about the role of this House. It is probable that we will have to take account of today's events in amendments to the Financial Services Bill. My view of the first day in Committee on the Financial Services Bill was that it was pretty apolitical and very much about getting the right result for the country. I hope that we can carry on in that way. We will do what we can to co-operate on bringing in any changes. We must, through the usual channels, make sure that there will be time to scrutinise properly.
Turning to yesterday's events, the first area I shall touch on is what is to be done. The Government have claimed that the Financial Services Bill would have created a different result and would have markedly improved the situation. In the Statement, there is no illustration of what that means. I would value the Minister setting out briefly what parts of the Bill are going to change. I have done my best to try to understand the Bill, and I do not see the obvious areas, but if they are there, we will help get them into law and make sure they happen. If the Minister will set those things out, it would be valuable to the House.
Secondly-I shall stop the numbers because they will go on for ever-the regulation of LIBOR and its derivatives was rejected in the other place by the Minister. I am not quite sure what the Statement says.
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The Statement talks about criminal sanctions. Criminal sanctions are extraordinarily difficult to bring about because of the burden of criminal law. It is fair to say that you cannot find them in the current legislation, and yes, okay, it is our fault-I hope my leaders do not hear me say that. One of the reasons is that it is extraordinarily difficult to bring criminal sanctions into an area such as this where the criminal burden of proof is so high, but if the Minister can illustrate with a few examples what criminal sanctions the Government are thinking about, once again, we will listen to his remarks very attentively.
Let us move on to the victims. The Statement referred to, I think, millions of families and thousands of businesses. These people have probably lost out financially. What are the Government proposing to do about recompensing them? Are they going to bring in any law, or at least address the balance between shareholders and customers in this very difficult area of financial services? This is a scandal akin to the PPI scandal, and we have to recognise its size.
There is the issue of balance. Forgive me, but I will keep coming back to it. There is the concept that the law should contain a duty of care to customers. We are not yet at that point in the Bill, but I would welcome the views of the Minister about whether we should move across that spectrum towards customers having legal rights if, through their processes, the financial institutions they are trading with have put them at an unreasonable disadvantage. It will be difficult to frame, but we have to think about this balance and we have to be in a situation-for a number of reasons that I will come on to-where victims have real care. Finally in this section, the Financial Services Bill is a good vehicle. It will need co-operation, but we encourage the Government to do it. We must do it in a highly scrutinised way.
What is going to happen to those responsible? I am sure that if there are criminal routes, they will be taken. I point out to Members of the House that, frankly, this is not for the Government. Criminal actions and criminal prosecutions are for the appropriate prosecuting authorities, and I hope we can trust those authorities to pursue any criminal sanctions with due vigour. We would expect nothing less of them, and we will be deeply critical if they do not. The FSA probably has powers short of criminal sanctions against individuals to stop them holding office and so on. It would be valuable if the Minister could lay out a little detail. Are they available? How will they be applied?
The real sanction in this case will be in the hands of the Barclays board. It is for that board to act, and to show it is acting, in a way that sends a message that this bank is going to change how it behaves. The tests set out by the Chancellor are incomplete. It is not a matter of what the chief executive knew or when he knew it; it is what action he took to make sure that he was seeking to know and that there were processes in place to assure him that proper responsible actions
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We come finally to culture change. I have been in the culture change business. I have not run a great bank, but I ran what I consider to be a great institution that is responsible for 2 million people a day and for their lives. Less than a year before I took over, it had killed 31 people. The result was that the boss at the time was fired, after a proper inquiry, his boss was fired, and I ended up head of that organisation. The key change we made was to ensure that everybody was personally responsible. If a death occurred on the Underground, it was my responsibility. It was my responsibility not to check the particular area, but to be able to assure myself that I had done all that was reasonably practical for such a thing not to happen. Indeed, on most occasions one finds that one has learnt something or has to do something more, but all the way through the management chain individuals have to be personally responsible. That burden of responsibility to probity failed in this case.
In addition, we have to look at the bonus structure. We do not talk about bonuses bluntly enough. Frankly, you introduce bonuses to change behaviours. You change behaviours in what is arguably an acceptably benign way. You get people to work longer hours, with more vigour, to be more inventive and so on, but unfortunately a bonus culture will push you to the edge of regulation. When you do that, you have to make sure that the systems are in place to prevent that push beyond the edge of regulation. That requires enormous care and is an enormous responsibility for the board.
The culture must change in the banking industry and it must change from the top. This board must be seen to take decisive action, as indeed must all boards. This is a very, very serious day. This leaves a stain on Britain. Let us be frank about it: before today, people believed that bankers were greedy and stupid, and, sadly, they now know that they are dishonest. For the financial centre of Europe, that is a pretty unhappy combination. We are calling for the strongest punishment for those who have broken trust and broken the law, tough regulation to prevent such practices and a culture change in our banking industry. We must get our economy working, and we must remove this stain on our reputation and repair it. We on these Benches will do all we can to bring that about as quickly as possible.
Lord Sassoon:My Lords, I am grateful to the noble Lord, Lord Tunnicliffe, for confirming the Opposition's support for possible amendments to the Financial Services Bill to reflect these matters and for his frank admission that there may be lacunae in the law that now need to be plugged.
The noble Lord, Lord Tunnicliffe, asked what the Bill will do to improve matters. First, we are creating a focused conduct regulator, the FCA, which will supervise in a much more focused way than the FSA the conduct of markets because it will not have all of the prudential side to look at. The FCA's operational objective of protecting and enhancing market integrity goes to the heart of our discussion. Because it is a self-standing body, the FCA will create a different culture and risk appetite. It will take a tougher, more proactive and more focused approach to these sorts of issues and there will be specific powers that we will discuss in detail through the Bill's proceedings. For example, in circumstances like this, the new power of the FCA to disclose the fact that a warning notice in respect of a disciplinary matter has been issued means that the FCA will be able to disclose that it is taking action at a much earlier stage in an investigation than the FSA. So the new structure will be much better suited to dealing with this sort of problem.
There is also a lot of ongoing work to review how the LIBOR-setting process works. There are consultants involved with the BBA and the panel banks working with the FCA. There is a supervisory committee for this work on which the Treasury sits as a non-voting member but providing strategic steer for the work. I would expect findings to be published from that review within the next few months. There are all sorts of ideas floating around, such as changing the LIBOR data to actual trading data rather than the submission basis we have now and whether there should be a new LIBOR code and so on. So there are a lot of ideas, the work is well advanced and will be reported in the next few months.
The criminal law ought to be the last stage. As the noble Lord said, we have to get the culture right within the banks,. We have to have appropriate powers in the FCA to be able to detect things as early as possible and take action. We need to see whether there are any gaps in the criminal law. As with the forthcoming report into RBS, there will be a consultation on whether there should be new criminal sanctions on negligent directors of failed banks. So this is very much on our mind.
The noble Lord then asked about people who have lost money. This is a difficult issue because it is not possible to know whether LIBOR has been manipulated on any particular day. It will be impossible to know what the effect of the attempted manipulation has been, if any. It is a complicated rate-setting process which means that half of the submissions that go in are excluded from the calculation. So some of these fraudulent or incorrect rates that went in-I should not presume anything that hints at criminality; that is for others-may not have got into the calculation. So we do not know whether people have benefited because the rate went up higher or lower than it should have been. People could have either benefited or lost out; it is not clear.
The noble Lord made some interesting observations about culture and management and so on. My right honourable friend did not want to list all the questions that the Treasury Committee will no doubt ask of the chief executive of Barclays but I am sure they will include one or two of the questions that the noble Lord put.
Lastly, the noble Lord talked about the stain on the banking industry. It is important to say that, although it is indeed a stain on the banking industry and that it has significant effects on London and the UK, there are also banks under investigation that are not British or headquartered and managed from the UK. There were regulatory failures in the run-up and through the financial crisis in the US and other countries. So, yes, it is a serious day for the banking industry; yes, there is a stain that needs to be dealt with; and yes, London needs to clean up its act but it is not only the UK that is involved in this.
Baroness Kramer: My Lords, the public are rightly outraged by the manipulation of interest rates and Europe is going to look more suspiciously at London just at a time when we are trying to protect the City. So there are great issues at stake.
Will the Minister explain why the FSA's fine to Barclays is so small? As far as the company is concerned, £59.5 million is a freckle and far less than the fine in the United States. Surely they are not the senior regulator in this case. Why are there no sanctions at all-we are not just talking about criminal sanctions-against anybody senior? It is one thing to go after the traders but systematic mismanagement and manipulation of the market over four years surely affects senior people and has to engage them. The questions are to be asked by the Treasury Select Committee, which is an outstanding Committee, but surely they should be coming from the regulator with the ability to follow with direct sanctions.
Lastly, it is crucial that the Financial Services Bill is looked at again because, although we have a new form of regulator coming in the FCA, which I hope will be rigorous and effective, we must ensure in this Bill that the regulator has real teeth so that there is fear when that regulator looks again at this kind of mismanagement, and a fundamental change in behaviour.
Lord Sassoon: My Lords, I share the concerns of my noble friend. This is the largest fine ever imposed by the FSA. The US comes at this in a different way in many respects so the seriousness of the issue is demonstrated by the size of the fine in relation to anything else that has ever been done by the FSA in this country. It is the largest. The FSA sets the fines and it should do so. This has to be an independent process and I am sure nobody would want the Government involved in it.
As far as the investigations are concerned, my noble friend may be jumping ahead of the ongoing investigations by the FSA and SFO. I do not know where they will come out or who will be involved, but those investigations are going on. As for a powerful regulator for the future that is able to do this, I could not agree with her more. The FSA model completely failed. As I have already explained, the Financial Conduct Authority will be focused and will have as a core objective the integrity of markets. It will be much better placed to deal with these kinds of problems as they come up in future.
Lord Morris of Aberavon: My Lords, when I was a young barrister, I occasionally prosecuted, on behalf of the Board of Trade, persons thought to be unfit to be directors of a public company. Those cases, as I recollect, were not all that difficult. The Minister has mentioned criminal sanctions, where of course the burden of proof is the usual one and it is high. Without prejudice to a particular case, is similar procedure still available to prevent directors from holding positions in future on the grounds of unfitness?
Lord Sassoon: My Lords, I am grateful to the noble and learned Lord. As I said, we have concerns about the question of directors, particularly directors of banks, to make sure that the regime is appropriate and tough enough. The regime for directors of banks, because of the special nature of their role, should be looked at on its own merits. That is why it is timely that the RBS report and consultation, going very much to this point, will be published next week by the Treasury. I hope that we will get a debate going about what is appropriate in terms of the special regime that might be appropriate for directors of failed banks if they are shown to have behaved negligently.
Baroness O'Cathain: My Lords, the Statement says that this was going on throughout 2005, 2006 and early 2007. Was it stopped in 2007, or has it been going on since then? I wonder whether it has been going on for another five years. If so, what do my Government propose that we should be doing? Can we actually believe these people?
Lord Sassoon: My Lords, on the particular case, the FSA report sets out what was going on. The important point for my noble friend is that the point of highlighting the dates which my noble friend gave was that this activity was going on before the financial crisis. It was going on in an atmosphere of greed in what were perceived to be the good times. When the financial crisis hit, the activity of the individuals at Barclays was motivated by something else, which was to do with the reputation and standing of Barclays in the market. The particular relevance of those earlier dates was to distinguish what then happened during the later period, in the financial crisis.
As the FSA and other regulators' investigations go on, they will tell us more about the extent and duration of these activities. Given that the banks have been on warning of this for a period, I would like to think that they have taken significant steps to clean up their activity. We want to make sure that, as I have described with this ongoing review of the LIBOR system, the system is appropriate to the new market circumstances.
Lord Radice: As a former chairman of the Treasury Select Committee, I of course strongly support the idea of its investigation. Does the Minister agree that if the executives of Barclays did not know what was going on, they ought to consider their position? If they did know what was going on, they ought to resign immediately.
Lord Sassoon: My Lords, the noble Lord, Lord Radice, makes some good points, which I am sure the chief executive of Barclays will be pressed on when he comes before the successors to the noble Lord on the Treasury Select Committee.
Lord Hughes of Woodside: My Lords, in the Minister's Statement he repeatedly says that there were failures of the regulatory system and it was matter of greed, and so on and so forth. What was going on was not a failure. It was deliberate criminal deceit. Under those circumstances, how can the Minister possibly say that criminal charges should be the last resort rather than the first resort? By all means, let us try to tidy up the system. In view of what appears to be absolute, outright criminality, we should recall that fraudsters rely on the fact that they will escape the law through such mealy-mouthed words.
Lord Sassoon: My Lords, I am certainly not going to jump to premature conclusions which are not for the Government-or, I suggest, other Members of this House-to jump to, about what is or is not criminal activity. I have made it quite clear in repeating my right honourable friend's Statement that investigations continue by the FSA and the Serious Fraud Office. We will hear the views of the appropriate authorities in due course on these matters, but those investigations are ongoing.
Lord McAvoy: My Lords, from every noble Lord and noble Baroness who has spoken there has been consensus on the seriousness of this, and also about making sure that the appropriate steps are taken to, at the very least, prevent a repeat of it. However, moving forward should be done on the basis of honesty and not scoring cheap points. It is regrettable that the Minister used the word "clueless" to describe the previous Government. If the Government want consensus, as everyone who has spoken does, they should make sure that there is no repeat of that, or they might be asked what measures their party proposed during that time.
Lord Sassoon: My Lords, during earlier parts of today, I have criticised the former Government's behaviour and policies on certain matters. I have commended certain things that they had done. In this case, I stand by the words of my right honourable friend the Chancellor.
Lord Foster of Bishop Auckland: Does the Minister agree that the apparently noble gesture of the directors of Barclays in waiving their bonuses this year is not good enough? I will be pretentious and say that we, the people, demand that they pay back every bit of the bonuses for the years in question.
While we are talking about this, I cannot remember-because I have been in this place for so long-whether the process of deregulation was begun by the Minister's Government. It was the noble Baroness herself who elevated greed to a virtue. Then the whole international financial consensus pleaded with us all for soft-touch regulation. That is what they got. We were wrong, but they were wrong for exploiting it. They, and not the two Governments who have been involved, are culpable.
Lord Sassoon: My Lords, on the noble Lord's first point, I am sure that the board of the bank in question will listen to his views on bonus matters. That is principally a matter for the board of Barclays Bank to consider.
The noble Lord, Lord McAvoy, has said that we should not get too far into prior history here. There is a risk that I will get drawn into these matters. It was Mr Gordon Brown and Mr Ed Balls who espoused very explicitly the virtues of light-touch regulation, and that was the environment in which these traders operated.
Lord Empey: My Lords, LIBOR rates could not have been interfered with by one institution alone. There would have to be accomplices. I therefore presume that that is one of the directions in which the investigation will go.
Is the time ever going to come again in this country when someone takes professional responsibility for what is going on, leaving aside the criminal activities that will be pursued by the regulatory authorities? Is no one going to take professional responsibility and suffer a professional sanction if they are found in default?
Lord Sassoon: My Lords, on the first point made by the noble Lord, Lord Empey, as I have said, other banks are being looked at by the relevant supervisory authorities here and in other countries. All that is ongoing. I very much endorse what the noble Lord has to say about the profession taking responsibility. If the banking industry wants to be thought of as a profession, clearly it should think about how it re-establishes professional standards. I speak as a chairman of the ifs School of Finance, the former Institute of Bankers, so I feel very strongly about that and believe that the profession needs to think about it very clearly.
I am not aware of public authorities being involved. I can be pretty clear that no public body is involved in any way in the LIBOR-setting regime and is therefore not involved in what we are discussing this afternoon.
Lord Lea of Crondall: My Lords, would the noble Lord remind us of the basis of company law? In whose interests are the banks supposed to be operating? Is it, in some sense, the public interest, the customer's interest, the worker's interest? Whose interest is being served by the banks? Is he satisfied that there is now a general perception in this country that it is not like that at all and that the banks are operating in the interest of some people at the top of the banks?
Lord Sassoon: My Lords, I think the issue here is that, whatever the law says about the way in which the banks have to operate, the behaviour that has been exposed in this case is that of naked greed, and that is completely unacceptable whatever the legal framework. It is at heart an ethical question as much as anything
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Lord Marlesford: My Lords, is not one of the most serious aspects of this whole thing the potential economic consequences that are going to come from the reputational damage to the City of London, which is so important to the British economy? Would he agree that the only way of restoring reputation from malfeasance is to seek out and deal very publicly with those who are responsible? Does he remember-I remember all too well, as I declare myself to have been a victim of it-the malfeasance in Lloyd's of London, which was never really sorted out because no one was held to book and certainly no one suffered any particular penalty that I can recollect. One thing that they seem to be able to do in the United States is to deal very severely with individuals who are found to have misbehaved from positions of great financial responsibility.
Lord Sassoon: My Lords, I completely agree with my noble friend Lord Marlesford that the reputational consequences here are very serious. I stress the point that this is not simply a London or a UK banks' issue as it appears. The inquiries clearly cover other regulators and other banks and we will see where they go. However, it is precisely because of the significant reputational damage that the Chancellor has come forward immediately with his response, which I repeated this afternoon.
On the question of Lloyd's of London, without repeating the tortured and difficult history there, it is worth saying that after a long and difficult period for that market, Lloyd's of London is at the forefront again of the world's specialist insurance market. It has a critical position and is, I believe, stronger than ever. While we certainly do not want to go through a long and difficult period, as Lloyd's of London did, it does show that well-regulated markets in London are capable of leading the way in innovation and value-adding in financial markets.
Lord James of Blackheath: I make one observation, perhaps as a correction of the comment made by the noble Lord, Lord Marlesford. I speak as the former chairman of the committee that created Equitas for the solution of the Lloyd's of London problem and put in place the Equitas solution. The difficulties with Lloyd's of London were caused, to a very large extent, by another great failure of regulation by a parallel market in America. It was not wholly a United Kingdom problem. The problems of Lloyd's of London were exacerbated to an alarming extent by the failure of the US authorities to regulate the clubs that were put together for litigation purposes on a group class action basis relating to asbestosis, which allowed open, free entry to anyone who wanted to join, regardless of the fact that they had never been near a scrap of asbestos in their whole life. This is what created the enormity of the problem. It was a massive failure of regulation by
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Lord Addington: My Lords, first, I thank everyone who has taken the trouble to put their names down for this debate. I must also declare a series of interests. I am not only dyslexic but vice-president of the British Dyslexia Association and patron of the Adult Dyslexia Organisation, and I work for Microlink, a company that provides support for those with disabilities and of which I am chairman.
When I linked autism and dyslexia and included them in hidden disabilities, the main point that I was trying to make was that anything that is not easily spotted at the start of the educational process, whenever someone chooses to take that, leads to problems if it impedes one's learning or classroom situation. How early one gets in and identifies the problem is crucial.
I will say only a few words on autism, starting with Asperger's, for the simple reason that there are many people in the Chamber who know far more about the subject and can talk from greater depth of knowledge than I will ever be able to. Those with Asperger's, who are on the edge of a spectrum, are often identified later as a result of interaction with other people outside the home when it becomes less difficult to spot. This would be made much easier if someone was trained in the initial stages of education and in the classroom, and indeed if that training was not a limited introduction, to be able to spot it later on as problems start to manifest themselves, often simply because they were not dealt with earlier.
The problems of social interaction-taking things too literally; not being able to communicate properly; non-verbal communication, which is so important even when talking in this Chamber-create other problems if they are not picked up. We must have someone who can recognise these problems and get in earlier. I am really calling for people to be trained throughout the education process to pick these up. Also, education and training are supposed to be lifelong. All conditions for which there is not this embedded knowledge, and even sometimes when there is, are going to be spotted later on in life. Therefore, we must not limit ourselves to training just in the education sector.
I appreciate that the noble Lord, Lord Hill, may find himself having questions directed at me that might go to BIS, to the Department for Work and Pensions, or to the Department of Health-certainly in the case of autism. We had a little exchange earlier in the week when he asked what the best lead department would be to drive something. I suggest that when it comes to some of these conditions, the Department for Education could be of the most benefit, certainly for dyslexics. The basic few examples that I have given for autism and dyslexia are very clearly there.
A good point is dyslexia, because the problem occurs when one starts to use written language. Dyslexia, which I believe means "difficulty with words" in Greek, becomes apparent of course when one starts to learn to read and write. To access all forms of education and training in our society as we are going through, one has to have those two basic skills. If you do not deal with those, you are at an eternal disadvantage.
This situation is getting more prominent-I was about to say worse-for the simple reason that as we formalise our skill base more, measure it and try to support people, there are more and more occasions when you have to write something down or react to written information. Whether it is on paper or on the screen, that requirement is always there. There is a greater emphasis on the written paper in the modern driving test, as opposed to the one that I took. I do not have to go on much further because we can all think of examples. That is what we have if we do not deal with the situation for certain people.
It is reckoned that 10% of the population are on the dyslexia spectrum. I think it is 1% for autism. We could have mentioned many other hidden spectrums, such as ADHD, dyspraxia and dyscalculia. We are probably getting up to about 15% without trying. I do not know what that percentage is in every classroom, but it is a very high one, so we must have a degree of knowledge based in that classroom for early intervention.
Why have I brought this matter forward at this present time? It is because we are having a look at the whole special educational needs sector-we are coming down the track. The Government have made proposals. However, I do not know whether this was intentional-I hope that it was not-but the people concerned with these non-obvious disabilities have heard warning bells rung by some of the language that was used. This may be a chance for the Minister to muffle those bells a little in the process of his speech. I refer to things like, "We will concentrate on things and get a whole cross-departmental approach towards making sure that people go through. We will cut down the number of people on the special educational needs register. We will concentrate better".
Unless we have people with expertise based in the front, identifying the problem, we cannot do these things. Even if we redefine someone with dyslexia as not having a special educational need, because the system can use it, they are still dyslexic, and dyslexic throughout their lives. It is not something that you get rid of; it is a disability and it is to do with the organisation of your brain. It is there for ever, as I know to my cost.
"Dyslexia is a learning difficulty that primarily affects the skills involved in accurate and fluent word reading and spelling ... Characteristic features of dyslexia are difficulties in phonological awareness"-
There is a great deal more in that vein to be found in the document from Dyslexia Action. It is always there, and you will always have a different learning process, which means that every time you go into a new phase of your educational and training process you will always have the problem. The way in which it is dealt with will change over time, as will the way in which you deal with it and your interactions with other people. That will change under the pressures on you, but it is always there. If we get teachers trained initially and then make sure that others throughout the system have the support and knowledge of what was happening, we will take a huge step forward. We must make sure that the interaction and the different learning process never become a barrier. We must allow people to explain it.
If someone has the condition explained to them, they start to be able to take the appropriate steps to mitigate the condition. If a teacher goes up to a child and says, "You're not stupid, you're dyslexic", that teacher and all other teachers have an infinitely better chance of a positive relationship than they would if they did not identify the problem. You can then go and tell the parents. The dyslexia world is full of the recurring story of parents saying, "My child is dyslexic and I have discovered that I am". How do people get through life? They will say, "I never take notes-I always ask someone to do it for me"-as a result of having never kept a pen on their person for more than about three seconds at a time. They are dependent on partners, and so on. Those are the success stories.
In our prison population, about 70% or 80% are reckoned to have problems with literacy. Every single assessment of the prison population that has looked at it has come up with the figure of about 50% being in the dyslexia spectrum. If you take on board the idea that if you cannot access education you cannot access training because you cannot go through the process with a technical ability to read and write-and thus you cannot get employment-you have a far greater likelihood of becoming an offender. Asperger's, I am afraid, is also highly represented. Possibly not communicating as other people do might lead to conflict. It is a very complicated and worrying situation. If you do not get in there early and coherently, it will cause problems.
What do I want done? Sir Jim Rose presented, under the previous Government, a model for the better training of dyslexics within the teacher training programme. You have to make sure that that is used not only in the initial training but throughout the system. Throughout the process of training, it is equally appropriate. The noble Baroness, Lady Wilcox, might well be able to regale my noble friend on the Front Bench with the long series of meetings that we have had over apprenticeships. The previous Government decided that they would reassure employers about standards in training and said that everyone must pass an English key skills-now functional skills-test. When challenged on this, they said that they would make a change, but I think that it fell through the cracks in the changeover of Governments. All I know is that I have spent the better part of two years chasing around to get those people the same support and help to get an apprenticeship that you currently have to get a degree-or at least for there to be no greater barriers.
At the last meeting I had, it was agreed that assisted technology could probably be used to get through this test. Someone said, "Well, no one has complained about it-we haven't had one letter or e-mail". You get that degree of resistance further up. I have had meetings with the Department for Work and Pensions, usually under the last Government. There is nothing new here. They said, "Well, yes, we've got people with needs who are long-term unemployed. We should help them". "How?" "Oh, it's complicated-we'd have to get more training packages". "Yes, please do". The Department for Education is uniquely placed to set a precedent for good training and awareness. That department can drive this. If it cannot, it can at least build the engine and hope that someone else will put their foot on the accelerator.
We must do something here to address the problem. Some 10% of the population with dyslexia are underachieving in many cases, sometimes becoming a drag on our society. The figures for autism might be smaller, but the problem is as profound, man for man, if not more so. We have to try to address the problem, but we will not do so unless we get a greater degree of awareness throughout the system. We have to get agreement. Every time a dyslexic has to deal with a form, they are at a disadvantage. Every time you ask someone to fill in a process that has anything to do with reading and writing, a dyslexic is potentially disadvantaged. We have to make sure that at all these points there is someone there who understands and, when you say, "I am dyslexic", will understand that slight adaptions should be made. Assistive voice to text and text to voice technology is very old beer now. I have been using it personally for over 12 years. It is now comparatively easy to use. We have a way forward. This is something that could be integrated into the classroom more easily. It need not be that big a problem-all you need is slightly different patterns of dealing with this.
I look forward to hearing from my noble friend when he replies that the Government are taking this on board and that his department is driving this through the whole machinery of government. If it does not do so and merely concentrates on the schools
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Baroness Browning: My Lords, I refer the House to the Register with my interest in autism charities. It is a great privilege to follow my noble friend who has brought the debate to the Floor of the House today. He is a passionate advocate, particularly for those with dyslexia, and also always speaks out for those with what he termed-I think quite rightly-the "hidden disabilities". As he said, somebody can meet someone they do not know, talk to them, observe them and not think that there is a problem-particularly with dyslexics and those with autism, and those on the more able end of the autistic spectrum such as people with Asperger's syndrome.
Although there is still so much more to do, we know that several things have been done that have improved matters for all these children. When I started out as an MP more than 20 years ago, I remember in my constituency casework meeting professionals both in education and in health-doctors and teachers-who denied that autism or dyslexia existed at all. There were parents in my constituency who were paying privately for their dyslexic children to have tuition on Saturday while their classroom teachers denied that such a condition existed.
It has been a real battle to get autism up the agenda. Of course, both Houses agreed in the previous Parliament to an Autism Act. I say to my noble friend that I am increasingly concerned at the number of government departments that seem to be oblivious to the fact that there is an Autism Act on the statute book. Yes, it does focus very much on health, social care and integration-but it particularly affects those in transition out of education through those very difficult years into adulthood. I urge my noble friend-as I have urged other colleagues in other government departments-to make sure that, when they are legislating and looking at codes of practice, they look at what the House has determined should be the future for people coming out of education who are on the autistic spectrum.
In the classroom there are so many things that relate both to dyslexia and to the more able children on the autistic spectrum. I was very interested to see the article, "Dyslexia Still Matters", in Dyslexia Action, which sets out effective practice that would make a difference. There were four very simple points, any of which could apply to autism as well. The first referred to:
We know that children who are different in any way very quickly become subject to playground bullying and name-calling. All too often in a classroom situation it will become apparent to other children that they are struggling with the work. This of course applies to both autism and dyslexia. I hope that we have gone past the stage where they are subject to name-calling by teachers. That sounds rather shocking but I can think of several examples where teachers told children
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I am a great advocate of integrated education for children with a whole range of disabilities but I draw a line where the school does not understand the condition well enough to take those practical steps-very often environmental ones-that will enable a child to learn. I emphasise "learn" because there are children who because of their nature sit passively at the back of the classroom and allow education to wash over them year after year. It is quite common, for example, that children with autism are very sensitive to light and noise-even to the noise of a lot of children talking in close proximity. They struggle to concentrate and hold on to thought processes and eventually give up.
What happens to those children? It is not rocket science. There have been enough studies into this for us to be able to deal with it. It should not be an ongoing problem. These children start to develop what we might describe as challenging behaviour in the classroom. The children-particularly the autistic ones-who start to chuck the chairs about are the ones who suddenly get the attention. The ones who sit quietly at the back and end their school days without the benefit of the proper education that their intelligence tells you that they were clearly capable of obtaining-they are the ones we are letting down. I come back to those who start throwing the furniture about. Challenging behaviour is difficult for any teacher in a classroom setting. We are all aware of the need for the teacher to think of the whole class and not just that one child who, on an ongoing basis, may be disrupting the education of the others.
I must say to my noble friend that I have concerns and have had them for a long time. Although the Government-and the previous Government-no longer believe that so many statements should be issued, one of the reasons for trying to obtain a statement for a difficult child in a classroom setting concerns the allocation of extra teaching hours for a teaching assistant. All too often that teaching assistant is not trained in the needs of that individual child-whether dyslexic, dyspraxic or autistic-but is used all too often to assist the teacher with the general management of the class as a whole. Therefore, the need for the individual child who has a statement of educational needs to really motor on with their education is something that, very often, is not addressed just by having a teaching assistant in the classroom, particularly in respect to autistic children.
Of course, autistic children are different. It is a danger to just lump them all together. Their needs will be different. They are individuals. Their teaching needs will be best addressed by an environment and a teaching process that recognise what those needs are-which needs to be put together after very careful assessment. If we are going down the route of not having as many statements-I am a great advocate of
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I want to share something with my noble friend. I suspect that his colleague in another place, Sarah Teather, will already be aware of it because on 11 July she will address the All-Party Parliamentary Group for Autism. The group has put together recommendations that we believe should apply to all autistic children. This will read across to other children. The recommendations are that every school should have a lead teacher for autism, and that all children and young people with autism and special educational needs should have an action plan, whether or not they have a statement, so that as they move through the transition period a record of what their educational needs were in school can go with them. The thing about children and education is that how you communicate with them when they have a communication disorder will apply as much when they become adults as it did when they were in the classroom. We are now talking about skills and services for life because, as my noble friend said, they will have this condition throughout adulthood-it does not apply only to the classroom.
The all-party group also recommends that there should be meaningful support for all young people with autism and SEN up to 25 years of age, including those who are not in further education. Some of these children, including some of the brightest, take a few more years than other people, because of their needs, to get there. If you do not give them the opportunity, the cut-off points in terms of their age can be detrimental. We have had debates in this House about the need to consider the needs of children through to age 25, and I think that the Government have been receptive. I hope that my noble friend will accept this.
Of the adult community with autism, 60% rely on their families for financial support and 40% live with their parents. Many people who have adult children with autism and other types of lifelong disability would recognise immediately that parenting is for life-it is for as long as you can continue to support that child. There are, therefore, very elderly pensioners supporting pension-age children. That is not unusual. It is important that we address the fact that many of these adults are sitting at home without the training or opportunity to make the positive contribution that many of them would like to make. That does not mean that you can just fix them up with a job. I commend my noble friend Lord Freud, who is not here, for personally taking a great interest in seeking to raise the number of people with Asperger's syndrome who get into work. He has set up a group that is liaising
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However, we should recognise that some issues regarding disabilities in training and employment in the workplace are more easily resolved than others. Some adaptations for disabilities, after management has been made aware and has put in practical adaptations, do not subsequently take up any management time. This is particularly the case with the Asperger's group. They need ongoing support in the workplace-although not to do the job; they can do some high-level jobs-and someone who understands how they function. How the individual functions and what works for them is as important in the classroom as it is in the workplace. We should help them make that transition and give them as much support and education in the workplace as we provide in the classroom.
Lord Morris of Aberavon: My Lords, I sincerely congratulate the noble Lord on winning the ballot for this very important debate on the disabled. I want to widen the range of his examples, because there are others who are disabled in different ways and there are general lessons to be learnt from the problems arising from how we deal, or fail to deal, with one form of disability, which then reflects on somebody else. I note the remarks of the noble Baroness who has just sat down on the importance of parenting, which is a lifetime problem. That is significant, too, for the disability that I will deal with.
I take part in this debate without any expertise whatever, not even "a veneer of expertise", as Mr Clegg has apparently said. I declare an interest as one of my grandchildren suffers from type 1 diabetes. It is a disability that is particularly acute for the young. I am happy to say that he is able to do most things except contact sports such as rugby, which is a pity. He sails, fences and skis, which pose no difficulty. I have been trying for some time to get separate figures for research into type 1 diabetes, as opposed to type 2, the latter of which affects, in the main, older people. Type 1 sufferers-the young in the main-are growing in number at an alarming rate. At last, I think I am making a breakthrough in the answers I am getting, which I appreciate. I believe I heard the Minister, some months ago, responding to a question on the issue of education for the disabled. He was both understanding and appreciative, and I said that if the opportunity arose I might say something in the future. I believe it is only in recent years that some of the difficulties of children with problems, sometimes underlying ones, are being understood better and allowances made for them.
I return to type 1 diabetes. I attended a meeting in the House only this week on the research that is taking place on type 1. However, I fear a real breakthrough on causes and treatment is yet to come. The causes are not properly understood and more research on such things as artificial pancreases is required. Despite all the care in the world, and even with the modern pumps that are worn by children, there is no assurance that the sugar/blood condition, if that is the correct term, is correct at all times. The problem can be particularly acute at night and I would not weary the House by reciting the number of telephone calls that sometimes have to be made at night to an absent parent, of the type the noble Baroness referred to, when the child is away on school activities.
As far as education is concerned, it boils down to this: there is no guarantee what condition the child with this problem will be in the next morning. It is an unremitting battle to take every step to avoid a hypoglycaemic event-the right blood-sugar level is crucial. If a child has had a difficult night, even if he avoids a hypo, I suspect he is not in as good a frame of mind as his counterparts to face difficult and testing exams. It is very bad luck indeed if he has had a hypo the night before or even an unacceptable blood-sugar level. Should one make allowances for this kind of disability or for any other disability?
In a different world, I read of questions being asked about some notable individuals who have distinguished themselves in Paralympics in the past and I read press reports as to whether they were really as disabled as it was thought at the time. As a criminal lawyer, who has had the privilege of examining and cross-examining medical experts over the years in a whole range of cases and conditions, I know that some judgments in these fields frequently have a degree of subjectivity. Hence, the inevitable difficulty of getting acceptable yardsticks on which to make allowances.
I do not wish to traverse subjects such as cot deaths but we will all have read about the cases, some of which I have been involved in, that involve a huge amount of controversy. Part of the difficulty of getting yardsticks is that the degree of subjectivity can be very high.
I fear that I have no real answer to the question of how best to deal educationally with a child who has been close to or, worse still, has developed a hypo the night before his exams. Perhaps the way forward-this point has general application-is for examiners to have some sort of guidelines concerning the need, to be accepted by preliminary identification. I have dealt with one disability but the same applies to the kinds of cases on which the noble Lord has concentrated.
The answer-these are only suggestions-may be to provide extra time in an exam for any child with a disability, or perhaps, appreciating the problems that might be entailed, some flexibility over the timing, perhaps postponing an examination for just a few hours. Such conditions would be helpful in ensuring
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When reading the briefing material that came to those of us who had our names down to speak in this debate, there was one particular statistic that jumped out at me. It was that, in a study carried out in 2003, 41% of a sample of 1,000 unemployed people were dyslexic. I do not know whether there has been an update, because that was almost 10 years ago, but it is a pretty damning figure. Therefore, if your Lordships do not mind, I am going to stretch the topic of this debate very slightly beyond education and training into the employment which we hope will result from them and which is an important component of a fulfilled life.
An example from the Dyslexia Foundation about an organisation called Training Plus Merseyside in my city of origin, Liverpool, was instructive. In 2004, it was told that 4% of its clients had a special educational need. It obviously had a hunch that this was a gross underestimate, so it did something about it. It did some staff training, invested in screening tools, paid for psychological assessment and used ICT interventions, and it found that the real figure was nearer to 30%. What that tells me is that, at least at that time, the number of people slipping through the diagnosis net at school was far too large and many of those were landing up as NEET-not in education, employment or training. Indeed, all young people with disabilities are two and a half times more likely to fall into the NEET category than their fully able peers. Of course, there is a large cost, both personal and economic, to this, so we need to get it right at the education stage before the situation becomes entrenched.
The Government understand the importance of early diagnosis and intervention and have announced professional assessments of children's health and development at the ages of two and five, as well as the phonics check at year one in primary school. I hope one can assume that the two and five year-olds' checks are done by multidisciplinary, experienced professionals, but the phonics test will be administered by ordinary classroom teachers. That is why it is so essential that all teachers, in their initial training, have a meaningful SEN unit, including information about how to recognise and source appropriate help for children who achieve low scores in the phonics test and who therefore may suffer from dyslexia at some level.
Of course, it is far more likely that the parents will have noticed a problem-particularly with that other hidden disability, ASD-long before the child goes to primary school. It is really sad that so many of them say that they struggle to access appropriate care in therapies. I met a parent recently who noticed something wrong when their child was two and sought medical advice when he was two and a half. The doctors would
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For parents with a child with severe ASD, working with their child and supporting him through his therapy and exercises is a full-time job. It is an enormous commitment, often meaning that they have to give up their own career, with the resultant stress on the family budget. However, if the condition is caught early enough and appropriate interventions are provided, the results can allow that disabled young person to be quite functional and lead a pretty normal life. However, adjustments have to be made in the education and work place and the person supported to reach his full educational potential and then become a productive worker. Even NICE says that this is a cost-effective intervention.
In schools, if the condition is not detected, as Charlie Taylor, the Government's behaviour adviser told the education Select Committee this week, it can result in bad behaviour. The noble Baroness, Lady Browning, has given us some graphic examples of that. As he pointed out, this is not the child's fault and should not be treated as such. Sadly, many employers also do not understand the conditions that we are talking about today and make no allowances.
Well, of course they do; but, sadly, only one child in four with autism continues their education beyond school due to lack of suitable courses and lack of support. However, many do persist and get university degrees. When you think of the struggle that they have had, it is tragic to learn that a quarter of graduates with autism are unemployed. That is much higher for their age group despite the fact that seven out of 10 employers who have autistic employees report a very positive experience and would recommend employing people with autism to other employers. It is a terrible waste of talent after such a struggle. It is no wonder that many of them succumb to mental health problems, welfare dependency, and so on. This must change.
The Government have introduced the Youth Contract to help unemployed young people to get into work, and I think we can safely assume that many of them will have dyslexia or autism, or may be somewhere on either of those spectrums. Can my noble friend the Minister tell me what special provision is being made within the Youth Contract for these young people? If it is not for them, who is it for? It is doubly important that these young people are catered for with appropriate courses and support into work, especially in the light of the impending duty to stay in education or training until the age of 17 and then 18.
I return to education and the much more common condition of dyslexia. The Government have made clear their deep commitment to improving literacy. They are also changing and improving initial teacher training and continuing professional development. These two things go together. In this country we work with teachers to improve their practice. We do not sack head teachers on national television, as Michelle Rhee,
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Will my noble friend the Minister say whether all the future vehicles for initial teacher training-including the ones in the new training schools-will have a compulsory SEN component, including training in how to recognise dyslexia and how to access the right support? Can he also say what is being done about teaching assistants? Again, the noble Baroness, Lady Browning, mentioned their importance. They are now an indispensible component of the staff of modern schools-especially primary schools-so it is vital that they have opportunities to specialise in supporting teachers with children with disabilities or special needs in their classrooms-which, actually, is most of them-and that they have a clear career path if that is the way they want to go. Can the Minister say something about that?
It surprised recently to discover that the Open University teaching courses, often used by teaching assistants to move on to be a full teacher, do not have the option to specialise in SEN. One has to do a general teaching degree first. This is a pity as many teaching assistants already have good experience with children with special needs and could do well on a specialist teaching course. If this is not correct, I hope someone will give me the information.
As we have heard, Dyslexia Action is calling for a national dyslexia and literacy strategy. You cannot have a literacy strategy without addressing dyslexia. As the noble Baroness, Lady Browning, has pointed out, there are four simple key elements: whole school ethos; knowledgeable teachers; creative adaptations to classroom practice so that all children can be included; and access to additional learning programmes and sufficient resources. This does not seem too much to ask and I hope the Minister can assure us that this will happen.
Lord Ramsbotham: My Lords, I, too, thank the noble Lord, Lord Addington, and congratulate him on obtaining this debate. Like other noble Lords, I admire the determination with which he has pursued these issues on many occasions in the House. I welcome the fact that we are debating this issue with the Minister because, from our exchanges both during education Bills and subsequently, I know what a keen interest he takes in these matters. Knowing that we are dealing with and talking to someone who has such an interest is encouraging for those of us who have concerns in this area.
I, too, have benefitted from the briefing that we have had for this debate, particularly from Dyslexia Action. However, I do not want to speak only about dyslexia because I find from the briefings that I get from organisations in all the various parts of the spectrum-ADHD, autism and so on-that they all have similar areas of concern. The best thing we can do is to bring all those groups and their concerns
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I declare an interest as chairman of the All-Party Group on Speech and Language Difficulties. Currently we are conducting an inquiry into the links between speech, language and communication needs and social disadvantage. I shall mention some of the emerging evidence that we are getting because it is relevant to this issue. In that connection, we have had two days of evidence this week, which I have found the most valuable and inspiring days I have spent in this House, listening to practitioners in the field.
As I have explained to the House, my motivation stems from an experience in a young offender establishment in Scotland when the governor said to me that if he had to get rid of all his staff, the last one out of the gate would be his speech and language therapist. When I asked why, he explained that the offenders could not communicate either with each other or with the staff, and until and unless they could, no one knew what to do with and for them.
I met the marvellous woman who was carrying out this work and asked her what she did. She said she had assessed them all and found hideous shortcomings, which she was able to do something about. I asked her who was the best person in England to do this work and she named a professor at Surrey University, who I asked to come with me into a young offender establishment, and she did. She assessed the boys there and found all kinds of things which were not being picked up in other assessments conducted in reading, writing and other skills.
These include substance-abuse-induced memory loss, hearing problems and sight problems. Most telling of all, however, 100% had the communication difficulties associated with 1% of the population. Clearly, there is a link in all this. I will not bore the House, but subsequent work in putting two speech and language therapists into young offender institutions for two years, academically evaluated, proved within a month that they were an absolutely essential part of the establishment.
Secondly, it identified very clearly that picking up these problems at the age of 15 was far, far too late. It has got to be done earlier. It is not just being able to engage with the people who were looking after them in the young offender establishment; they had missed out on being able to engage with teachers throughout the whole process of life until then. No doubt, that failure had a lot to do with the fact that they were in those establishments. He made this statement to me, which I have never forgotten, that the inability to communicate was the scourge of the 20thcentury, and it is certainly that of the 21st century. I couple that sentiment with two other statements that I have repeated on many occasions in this House. One was the marvellous remark of Winston Churchill's in 1910 that,
with the clear implication that it is your duty to find it. Secondly, it is my firm belief that the only raw material that every nation has in common is its people, and woe
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Thinking that through, therefore, I am very concerned that people with hidden difficulties and disabilities which could be identified early must have them identified, so that the talents and the treasure can be nurtured and developed not just for their benefit, but for the benefit of the nation as a whole. In preparing for this debate, I looked at my shelves upstairs and I was staggered at the amount of information and the number of reports on the subject. For instance, we had the Bercow report of 2008; the Department for Children, Schools and Families' better communication plan; the Field report on the foundation years; the Marmot review of health inequalities; the Allen report on early intervention; a joint consultation on the new approach to special educational needs from the Department for Education and Department of Health; the Department for Education's statutory framework for the early years; the 2012 Green Paper and the pathfinders; and, only today, another document from Dyslexia Action, Dyslexia Still Matters. These reports, together with masses of papers from the Communications Commissioner, the Children's Commissioner and many practitioners, all say the same thing: that if we are going to make progress, we must intervene early-and the earlier the better-to discover difficulties and disabilities and do something about them as soon as possible.
I turn to the evidence that we have been hearing. I was very pleased to hear from the Department of Health that four new service models are being produced jointly by that department and the Department for Education, together with royal colleges, health visitors, UNISON and others, with pathways for parents, children and practitioners. Two have already been introduced; one for pregnancy and the early weeks of life and one for pre- and early school from two to 10. Another two will be introduced for the nine to 19 year-olds. Furthermore, I am glad to see that there is one for the criminal justice system. There is clear evidence in this that the health and well-being boards which were formed in the recent Health and Social Care Bill have a very important part to play in this. Interestingly, however, a number of our witnesses have said how much they wish that the phrase "mental health" was eliminated from our vocabulary and "mental well-being" was used instead. It is a much more satisfactory term; "well-being' is a "doing" word, and might make people understand the problem better.
I come to the practicalities. We heard from a health visitor and a speech and language therapist from Northern Ireland that compulsory assessments are being conducted on every child at the age of two, and that health visitors have been trained by speech and language therapists to understand the symptoms they are looking for. They are picking up difficulties as well as disabilities, which is enormously encouraging. Northern Ireland has an advantage in that health and social care work together, which is not the case all over the country. The witnesses highlighted how hugely important this is because otherwise you begin to get fragmentation, which is difficult to deal with.
We then heard what is being achieved in Stoke-on-Trent. It has adopted a motto to the effect that communication is everyone's business and regards intervention as a multi-agency activity. Some 5,000 people have been trained to identify symptoms. They are not only teachers and parents, but policemen and voluntary sector workers. People are on the lookout for these things and the response is co-ordinated. Stoke has developed a staged pathway which I believe is a model that others could follow with advantage. Indeed, Staffordshire has been fortunate to have had for many years some visionary people working in this area, with research that goes back 10 years showing the benefit of taking this sort of work further.
We heard from representatives of children's services and speech and language therapists in Walsall. They realised that children entering secondary school had also not had problems identified. They have been assessing people as they enter secondary school. They have been doing this as a pilot for three years and they have some interesting data. Moreover, some schools have found that they have to do these assessments not just when pupils arrive, but at various stages of their passage through the school. I hope that that is not something which will be dismissed. It was interesting to note that after our evidence session, the people from Stoke married up, if you like, with the people from Walsall because they clearly reckoned that they had something to learn; you have to carry on beyond the early years.
Carrying on is the lesson in some excellent work that has been devised by the English Speaking Board for enhancing employability. What is absolutely crucial is the word "transition". Whatever we do with those who have hidden disabilities and difficulties, having found them, we have to concentrate on the transitions from stage to stage not only throughout their education but on leaving school and making the transition into the workplace, and then on through life.
Later in the year we shall issue a report about this. It will say, frankly, that we think this is an area that needs national oversight. We are concerned that local authorities will be responsible for certain parts of it, with the healthcare and teaching sectors responsible for others. Unless someone pulls all this together, people will continue to fall through the cracks.
The other message that comes through strongly in the report I saw today from Dyslexia Action is that the solutions lie in using existing knowledge and good practice because there is masses of it out there. Rather than reinvent the wheel, for heaven's sake, let us exploit the valuable expertise and experience of the marvellous people who do this terrific work.
As the title of this debate suggests, it is essential that appropriate teaching and training are available and accessible to all people according to their ability and talent. The ethos of the English Speaking Board is that every person is an individual with unique capabilities and problems who must not be compared with another; rather, each must be judged on their own merits. I hope that the Minister will be able to assure the House that a national approach which makes certain that people are not allowed to slip through the net from the moment of an early assessment at two
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Lord Touhig: My Lords, we are indeed indebted to the noble Lord, Lord Addington, for securing this debate and also for the very powerful advocacy that he displayed when he opened it this afternoon. Finding a job is difficult enough these days, especially if you are a young person. Consider how much harder it is if you are disabled. In particular, if you are a young person with learning and developmental disabilities, accessing the right support and opportunities to find a job is especially challenging. On top of this, you are part of a substantial cohort of young people with special educational needs and disabilities, all of whom are likely to be unemployed, too.
In 2009, the Department for Education showed that 30% of young people who had a statement of special educational needs when they were doing their GCSEs, and 22% of young people with a declared disability, were not in education, employment or training when they reached the age of 18. This compares with just 13% of their peers. The Department for Education's National Pupil Database 2009-10 reveals that just 20% of children with special educational needs and statements achieved five A*-C grades-less than one-quarter of the rate for children without special educational needs.
One person in every 100 has autism. Consider the detrimental effect that this has on the employment prospects for adults with autism. Too many autistic children and their families are being let down by the special educational needs system and are struggling to access the support that they need. That is why I and a great many others welcome the Government's decision to reform the system through the forthcoming children and families Bill.
The noble Baroness, Lady Browning, has been a great champion and we all admire the hard work she does on behalf of people with autism. She referred to the All-Party Group on Autism's recent report, The Right Start: Reforming the System for Children with Autism, of which I have a copy. As a result of publishing the report, we will press the Government to ensure that the legislative opportunities down the tracks for change will benefit all children with special educational needs, especially and including those with autism.
Our report, which is based on a public survey and expert evidence from young people with autism, parents, teachers and professionals, leaves us believing that the Government's forthcoming legislation is perhaps a once-in-a-generation opportunity to make some significant change and improvement. Briefly, I will draw the House's attention to just five key points from the All-Party Group report. They cover training and best practice; specialist support at school; involvement of parents and young people; transition, or the extension of the SEN system up to 25; and accountability.
On training and best practice, 84% of respondents to our survey said that teachers were not given enough training to teach and support children with autism effectively, yet we know that training is essential to
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As a subtext, and on a matter that I have referred to before in the House, over 70% of youngsters excluded from school in England have SEN. That statistic should alarm us all. The mother of an autistic child gave evidence to our All-Party Group and said,
In a major National Autistic Society survey, 17% of children with autism have been suspended from school at least once, and more than 4% have been excluded permanently from at least one school. More than that, 32% of parents surveyed were asked to collect their child at lunchtime or before the end of the school day for reasons other than that the child was ill, and some 19% of parents reported this happening on more than four occasions.
Unless this is officially recorded, these types of exclusions are illegal, and we need to get this message across. Experts who came to give evidence told us that almost every single case of exclusion from mainstream school could have been avoided had more staff been aware of the children's needs, and had there been better planning at school level to support children with autism.
On specialist support at school, our report highlights the fact that children with autism can have a range of complex difficulties that often need specialist support-that is pretty obvious. Far too often, however, parents say that this expertise is simply not available. We certainly hope that the Government will ensure that all children with autism have access to the support that they need, including those without a statement, or an educational health and care plan. We certainly believe that every school should have a lead teacher for autism-a point made by the noble Baroness, Lady Browning.
Moving on to the matter of involvement of parents and young people, we discovered that less than half of parents of children with autism considered that they were truly involved in shaping the support that their children need and receive at school. Autism professionals we met agreed with this, and so did 30% of the teachers. Over 90% of parents said that they wanted to be more involved, and that they wanted schools and local authorities to work closely with them, sharing information and ensuring that a consistent approach is taken at home and at school.
The SEN system is to be extended to 25 year-olds, and they, too, must be involved in the decisions that affect their lives. As for transition, for too many families the struggle for services intensifies as young people reach adulthood, and as we were told in one evidence session, as statements of special educational need come to an end it often feels "like falling off a cliff". The Government have decided, I believe rightly, to extend the SEN system to 25 year-olds, but they must
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In quoting the noble Lord, Lord Freud, again, I echo the words of the noble Baroness, Lady Browning, who has been a great supporter of and friend to those who work actively on behalf of people with autism. The noble Lord said that the Government want to increase the number of people with autism in work to 30%, doubling it from 15%. We all share that ambition and we back him to the hilt in that.
Finally I will touch on accountability. An important aspect of any reform must be greater accountability for parents. Too many parents who came to give evidence to us said that they had to fight constantly to gain access to the support that their children needed. That is why we need an effective complaints system encompassing all state-funded schools, and it must be a priority, in order to ensure that parents have confidence in that system. Like many others, I wait eagerly for the children and families Bill, hoping and praying that it will help to show us the way forward.
Lord Clement-Jones: My Lords, I join other noble Lords in congratulating my noble friend Lord Addington on initiating this debate. Like them, I commend him on his consistency and persistency on these topics over many years. I must first of all declare an interest as the honorary president of Ambitious about Autism, the national charity for children and young people with autism, and I also declare a family interest in dyspraxia.
We have made some progress on the education of children on the autistic spectrum over a period of years, both under the previous Government and under this. I pay tribute to the two current Ministers who have shown an interest in this subject: my honourable friend Sarah Teather and my noble friend Lord Hill, who is to reply today. I will use this important debate to highlight the situation faced by young people with autism at a slightly older age and to suggest some solutions that might improve their ability to access education, training and employment. In view of the superb contributions that have been made in the debate, I will inevitably echo quite a large part of what other noble Lords have said.
What stops young people with autism accessing education and training? Ambitious about Autism research shows that 51% of Britain's schoolteachers have never received training to help them support children with autism. The noble Lord, Lord Touhig, referred to exclusion. Children with SEN are currently disproportionately likely to be excluded from school as a result of this lack of skills and understanding in their teachers. Responding to our research, 43% of parents reported that their child with autism had been formally excluded within the previous 12 months, and 55% of parents said that their child with autism had
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Beyond the problems surrounding exclusion, the current lack of teacher training in autism means that young people with autism are often in a classroom without any teaching staff who understand their needs. Quality of teaching is very important in ensuring that pupils with autism are appropriately recognised and supported and go on to reach their potential. Just one in four young people with autism continues their education beyond school. This is in part due to a lack of suitable provision, which my noble friend Lady Walmsley mentioned, poor funding structures and a workforce that requires additional support and training to support learners with autism. However, we know that young people with autism want to access employment and training, and we also know that they need the right support in order to do so. While there is a dearth of education and training available, young people with autism have very limited options.
A host of reports from recent years provided evidence that the transition to adulthood for young people with autism and other disabilities is poor and that there is a serious lack of educational opportunities for this group. Ofsted states that,
What impact does this have? The social impact of unemployment for young people with autism is huge. Not continuing in education or training beyond school leads to a loss of potential for young people and society. Disabled young people are 2.5 times more likely not to be in education, employment or training than their non-disabled peers, which is a direct result of failure to access appropriate education or training. Many young people with autism have very limited choices when they finish school. Often their only options are to stay at home with their parents or go to a residential care home, often with people twice their age. Failure to provide opportunities for education and training that will lead to employment denies young people with autism the right to fulfil their potential and contribute to society.
In addition to social costs, failure to provide for young people with autism leads to higher long-term financial costs. The National Audit Office found that £1 million per person could be saved by supporting young people with learning difficulties to gain the skills to live more independently. It also found that supporting a disabled young person to access work reduces lifetime costs to the public purse by £170,000.
So what is the solution? First, we need training for all school staff in autism and an awareness of other special educational needs and disabilities. I accept what the noble Lord, Lord Ramsbotham, said about bringing all of this together. This could include compulsory SEN training and a core autism module in initial teacher training. It is important that it is not just teachers who are included but also teaching assistants and supervisory staff such as mealtime supervisors.
Secondly, a school admissions code that ensures schools and admissions authorities are obliged to place children with autism in suitable schools is essential. We must guarantee an excellent education for all children and young people with autism. It is essential that schools have fair exclusions policies that ensure exclusions do not occur as a result of an unmet special educational need.
Thirdly, we need to ensure that government initiatives such as the Youth Contract are accessible to young people with autism and other disabilities, as a number of noble Lords said. Can the Government explain how they will make the Youth Contract fully accessible to disabled young people? Can they confirm that Access to Work funds will be available for young disabled people doing internships and volunteering placements?
Raising the participation age to 18 is welcome, but it appears little thought has been given to what this might mean for young disabled people, many of whom are not in employment, education or training-not through choice but through a lack of suitable provision. The raising of the participation age will help young people only if it coincides with the development of more and better educational provision. Have the Government committed the extra funding that is needed to meet the additional needs of young disabled people who are currently not participating? How have they calculated the level of this need? The funding must take account of all additional needs, not just those of young people with statements of SEN.
As part of Finished at School, Ambitious about Autism made a number of recommendations to improve post-16 education for learners with autism. I welcome the fact that one of those recommendations-a legal right to educational support for young disabled people up to the age of 25-has been adopted by the Government. I hope that, accompanying this, there will be a funding system that will give young people and families more information, choice and support, a cross-government focus on outcomes and destinations for young disabled people and a further education workforce with the skills to support young people with autism to achieve their ambitions.
It is not, however, all about government action. Ambitious about Autism, my own organisation, has launched a new strategy to create more and better services beyond school age. As part of the strategy, the charity is developing and launching new services to enable young people with autism leaving school to continue to learn so that they can transition to living and working as part of their home community. Their
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Lastly, I have a few points on education, training and employment for people with Asperger's syndrome-high-functioning autism-as well as others on the autistic spectrum. As the National Autistic Society say, while there are similarities with autism, people with Asperger's syndrome have fewer problems with speaking and are often of average or above-average intelligence. They do not usually have the accompanying learning disabilities associated with autism but they may have specific learning difficulties. These may include dyslexia and dyspraxia, or other conditions such as attention deficit hyperactivity disorder or epilepsy. With the right support and encouragement, people with Asperger's syndrome can lead full and independent lives.
People with autism, including Asperger's syndrome and high-functioning autism, often have much to offer employers. With the right support, they can contribute fully to the workplace. In a study carried out by Research Autism in 2008 for NAS Prospects (London) on the experiences of employing people with autism, seven in 10 employers questioned had had a positive experience of employing someone with autism and said they would recommend it to others.
The NAS has launched its Undiscovered Workforce campaign, which works at a national level with Ministers, employers and others, and at a local level with campaigners, MPs, local businesses, universities and individuals. I commend that campaign. I also very much welcome the particular interest shown by my noble friend Lord Freud in his capacity as Welfare Reform Minister-this was mentioned by the noble Baroness, Lady Browning-and the interest shown in employment issues by my honourable friend John Hayes, the Employment Minister in BIS. The NAS seeks to increase the availability of specialist employment support for those seeking work and those already in work to transform attitudes and increase opportunities for people across the autistic spectrum to fulfil their ambitions in the workplace.
Therefore, will the Government pull all these aspects together through their disability strategy, the Youth Contract and the forthcoming children and families Bill-which has also been mentioned in this debate-to make sure that young people with autism and others with special educational needs are appropriately supported to enter further education, higher education, training, apprenticeships and employment? I look forward to hearing what the Minister has to say.
Lord Storey: My Lords, I, too, thank my noble friend Lord Addington not just for securing this debate but for his passion in making sure at every opportunity that these matters are at the forefront of our consideration. I am sure that his determination will succeed.
I declare an interest as a practising head teacher. I was very mindful of what my noble friend Lady Browning said about young people being labelled in the past. Because of their learning difficulties, they were often regarded by their peers, and sometimes by their
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This did not just happen in schools. When I was doing my education degree, I vividly remember a very highly regarded lecturer in education almost dismissing dyslexia, saying, "There's no such thing. It's just made up. They don't have dyslexia in China, do they?". That was often the view at the time. Thank goodness we have moved on.
We then moved on to a period in which we began to understand dyslexia and other learning difficulties but did not know what to do about them. Resources were very limited. It would often be a parent who came into the school and said, "I think my child is dyslexic". The teacher would say, "Oh yes?", and would eventually get around to thinking about what might be done about it, but the resources were not there. We have come light years in what we are now able to do. Both the previous Government and this Government have taken enormous steps regarding special educational needs and are to be congratulated on what they have done. That is not to say that there are no further things that we should do.
I give one example of the progress that we have made, which touches my heart. A very close friend of mine has a daughter who has mild cerebral palsy. Although she required a bit of pushing from her parents-she was in the independent sector-she has been supported all the way through her education. She is now at Leeds University, which has been fantastic in supporting her. She obviously has a scribe whenever she is doing exams and so on. When she could not get the work in on time, they said, "Come on, we'll help you and make sure that's right". She repeated one year. This year, she will get her degree and the following year she will do a two-year masters degree. That is something of which, as a nation, we can be duly proud.
The only reason I got involved in this debate is my own personal experience. The previous Government rightly used the phrase, "every child matters". If we are going to make sure that every child matters, that has to be in everything. I look at my own school and at what we now do. First, we have an ethos that recognises particular special needs issues. On dyslexia, we have a qualified SpLD teacher who is, thanks to government funding, undergoing her masters. She is qualified to diagnose specific learning difficulties. The staff are also trained to identify characteristics of learning difficulties. They then use a checklist and go to the
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What happens when a child is identified as dyslexic? Obviously, we involve the parents. We put together strategies in the classroom. We look at intervention strategies. We look at one-to-one teaching. We look at a multi-sensory programme of teaching. Most of us learn in an auditory or visual way. If a young person is dyslexic, we need to do lots of oral work and what we call "over-learning"-learning strategies to cope.
What do we need to do as a country? Again, I agree with my noble friend Lord Addington and other noble Lords have made the same point. We need to ensure that the training is there. In each school, there ought to be somebody who is fully qualified. That needs to be a crucial, integral part of our initial teacher-training course.
I am grateful to the Minister for always being prepared to listen and give information. I think that he is probably fed up of my Questions, but I have asked him a number of them on dyslexia. They not only show that we understand what needs to be done, but they indentify next steps. The money that has been made available by the Government is to be commended. However, looking at the uptake of funding and the number of people who have taken training places, region by region-I will not embarrass various regions-there are huge regional variations and that gives me cause for concern.
In a recent Question I asked whether the Government would consider asking teaching training providers how many compulsory courses there were and how many optional courses there were. Sadly, we do not hold that information centrally. We need to hold that information. We need to know how many teacher training establishments make this provision, so that we can plug the gaps. We need to get that information.
I agree with my noble friend Lord Clement-Jones that we have made huge progress. I am heartened at what we have heard but I am absolutely sure that progress will continue to be made. With the noble Lord, Lord Hill, a Minister who listens and I am sure is prepared to act and, in the other place, a Minister, Sarah Teather, who believes strongly in special educational needs and early intervention, I am hugely optimistic.
Baroness Jones of Whitchurch: My Lords, I thank the noble Lord, Lord Addington, for initiating this debate today. He has an impressive track record of campaigning on these issues and both he and a number of noble Lords have given some very well informed and passionate contributions this afternoon. I really appreciated the opportunity to listen and
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I begin by reiterating the point acknowledged by my noble friend Lord Morris, the noble Lord, Lord Ramsbotham, and others in the debate, that while dyslexia and autism represent a proportion of the problem, there is a bigger challenge of hidden disabilities. For example, to give some other statistics, more than 3 million people have asthma in the UK, one in 200 people had epilepsy and one in four people will experience mental health problems-or should I say mental well-being problems-with an increasing number of young people in this category. Overall, it is estimated that around 70% of people with a disability in this country have a hidden disability. As the noble Lord, Lord Ramsbotham, rightly suggested, there is much to commend a united strategy to tackle these issues although there are individual elements to each of the disability issues, as we know and as we have rehearsed this afternoon.
The truth is that we have improved our medical skills in diagnosis and treatment, but these have not been matched by the ongoing learning and support guarantees necessary to enable young people to lead enriched lives and fulfil their potential or-as the noble Lord, Lord Ramsbotham, put it-to enable us to find the treasure within them. Despite the progress resulting from the Equality Act, we are still confronting levels of both overt and covert prejudice, institutionally and socially. These are lifelong challenges with very different solutions needed at every stage.
As we have heard, for young people with hidden disabilities in particular, even once a diagnosis has been made there is a subsequent fear of being adversely judged and labelled, or alternatively being disbelieved. At the same time, young people do not want to draw attention to their disability and appear to be different, either because they are embarrassed or, as we have heard this afternoon, because they fear bullying in a school or social environment. As a result they do not always access the funding and resources to which they are entitled.
While the original SEN programme played an important part in moving disability and special needs towards centre stage in the design and provision of local authority, school and personalised support-I thank the noble Lords who paid tribute to the previous Government's efforts in this regard-it had undoubtedly become too bureaucratic and formulaic in its execution. There were too many agencies involved, no incentives for joined-up services and a degree of piecemeal funding.
Therefore, we welcome many of the aspirations in the Government's special educational needs Green Paper and their response to the consultation. We support the concept of a single, simpler birth-to-age-25 assessment process and care plan with the right to a personalised budget for parents and young people to buy in support services. Parents tell us that these proposals match their aspirations for their children's
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We welcome the emphasis on providing an education that will help young people with disabilities into meaningful employment. But given the complexities of the new arrangements, and the need for parents to be reassured that there will be an improvement in the support given to their children, we would caution against rushing into legislation before the outcome of the 20 pilots, which are currently experimenting with the new proposals, have been properly evaluated.
The Minister will know that the interim report on the pathfinder pilots published this week is already flagging up some worrying concerns. For example, it is proving difficult to get agencies to work effectively together; assessments are being duplicated, not streamlined, as was the original intention; and the higher costs are judged not to be sustainable. More importantly, there are increasing criticisms that, contrary to their stated and well received objectives, the pathfinders are failing to involve young people themselves in the shaping of the new services. I raised this matter in Questions earlier in the week, and I once again urge the Minister to confirm that the full conclusions of the pathfinders will be evaluated before the Children and Families Bill is published. I would be grateful for his comments on this.
We would also expect the Government to set out clearly how the funding for these new, improved services will be guaranteed at a time when specialist posts are being lost due to deep cuts to council budgets and to health and welfare budgets. Could the Minister explain how the transition from separate budget heads in education, health and social care to an integrated, personalised provision will work in practice? Will they be expected at a local level to transfer funds into a separate pot, and it will it be ring-fenced?
As the Green Paper acknowledges, and a number of noble Lords around the Chamber this afternoon have said, education and training are central to addressing the needs of young people with hidden disabilities. As has been mentioned, it starts with initial teacher training courses and the need for compulsory modules on identifying, understanding and providing for children across the full spectrum of disabilities. It needs to be supplemented by specialist teachers trained in supporting young people in the classroom. It also requires sufficient teaching assistants, properly funded and trained to support the individual learning needs of specific children in the classroom. Those points were echoed by the noble Baronesses, Lady Browning and Lady Walmsley.
It also requires top-class careers provision in schools, which can give disabled young people specific advice about further and higher education courses and the employment options available to them. The Minister knows our continued concern about the quality of advice being provided by the new schools-based careers service, and we have a specific worry that children with specialist support needs will not get individual face-to-face advice to aim their skills at achievable ambitions. Perhaps the Minister could comment on this. Surely it should be a fundamental right of all children throughout the education system to have the same rights. Can the
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While no one would pretend that the provision in schools is perfect, the message from many disability groups and individuals is that it is the transition from school to higher or further education and ultimately into meaningful employment that remains the biggest challenge. Parents who have seen their child have good support at school can be shocked when they view the adult options available when their child reaches the age of 16 or 18, with specialist adult facilities dominated by much older attendees, often with complex needs, or when they are faced with an FE syllabus that does not provide courses on a full-time basis, leaving parents struggling to provide home care at other times of the week when courses are not being provided. This is why FE colleges need to be centrally involved in pathfinders and why it is essential that they have a statutory duty to be involved in the transition planning for individual young people at a very early stage in their education so that appropriate provision can be laid on in the FE colleges to meet their needs sufficiently in advance.
Finally, as several noble Lords have highlighted, the real challenge highlighted in this debate is about those with hidden disabilities finding and keeping meaningful work. As the noble Baroness, Lady Walmsley, and the noble Lord, Lord Touhig, identified, the statistics are, quite frankly, depressing. Disabled people are twice as likely to live in poverty as non-disabled people. Some 22% of young people with a disability were not in any form of education, employment or training when they reached the age of 18-twice the level of their peers. The Labour Force Survey showed that, in 2011, 41 per cent of men and 43 per cent of women designated longer-term disabled were also unemployed. The result, as we have heard, is too many young, capable people trapped at home with increasingly elderly parents.
The Sayce report for the Department for Work and Pensions identified a number of solutions with which we concur, particularly the personalised approach and the expansion of the Access to Work scheme, which they describe as the Government's best kept secret. This helped 37,000 disabled people into work in 2009-10. However, it needs to be better funded and more focused on helping those with hidden disabilities into work. The Government also need to focus on those with mental disabilities rather than seeing their role as just providing practical adaptations and support. Much greater emphasis should be placed on helping people access mainstream apprenticeships rather than separate, short-term internships, as seems to be the trend at the moment.
These are challenging issues-particularly challenging against a backdrop of central and local government cuts and welfare reform-that might face any Government. This Government have set out ambitious solutions for helping those with disabilities access quality education and jobs. However, with reducing budgets, the practical implementation may well elude them, leaving parents and young people frustrated and
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The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Schools (Lord Hill of Oareford): My Lords, I would congratulate my noble friend Lord Addington but I think he has had enough praise already this afternoon. He spoke, as I knew he would, with a great deal of knowledge. We all know the passion that he brings to the subject. I was grateful to him for doing so, and to my noble friends Lady Browning and Lord Clement-Jones, and the noble Lord, Lord Touhig, who spoke with equal authority about autism. The noble and learned Lord, Lord Morris of Aberavon, brought up the subject of diabetes, which I thought broadened the debate in an interesting way. The noble Lord, Lord Ramsbotham, spoke about speech and language difficulties, which is another manifestation of some of these issues that we are seeking to find solutions to.
As well as being a good debate, it is a timely one because, as noble Lords have said, the Government are introducing their children and families Bill, which in a way, I hope, sets the framework for much of what we have discussed this afternoon and how we hope to be able to improve things in future, because that Bill seeks to put into legislation a new framework for the education and training of disabled children, young people and those with special educational needs. The whole purpose of that new approach is to seek to promote better and earlier identification of children's needs-one of the recurring themes this afternoon-and a better transition from school to further education, higher education, adulthood and the world of work, which I think is one of the other recurring themes of this afternoon.
To my noble friend Lord Addington, who was keen that I should muffle some bells, I think was his phrase, I would say-I am sure he knows this-that the purpose of these reforms is not reclassification or trying to knock people off lists but about trying to bring together what has been too disparate a range of provisions into a simpler and more coherent whole.
Perhaps I may set out our overall policy direction, bring your Lordships up to date with the latest position in some key areas, and then try to respond to the main points put to me. We have heard a number of facts this afternoon. It is the case that there are some 220,000 children with statements of special educational needs. Last year, there were more than 165,000 young people aged between 16 and 18 with a self-declared learning difficulty or disability studying in mainstream further education colleges. We know that these children are less likely to achieve well at school and are four times less likely to participate in higher education. At 16 or 17, young people with learning difficulties and/or disabilities are almost twice as likely as their peers not to be in education, employment or training. Those figures and others that we have heard this afternoon powerfully underline the case for reform.
As we have been reminded, under the current system, needs are often picked up late, families too often have to battle to find out what support is available, teachers
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Put simply, our goal in these reforms is that from 2014 we will have a better integrated assessment process that is more streamlined and better involves children, young people and parents. There would be a single education, health and care plan for children and young people with statements or learning difficulty assessments for post-16 education in the current system. This would help to deal with the important point raised by my noble friend Lady Browning and others about the current cut-off at 16 and the problem that brings. The proposals will include an offer of a personal budget, for those who want it, to give families greater control over the services they use. The plans will give parents the right to express a preference for any state-funded school, including academies, or college. There will be a requirement that local authorities publish a local offer of services for disabled children and young people, and those with special educational needs. We will also introduce statutory protections comparable to those currently associated with a statement of SEN for 16 to 25 year-olds in further education, with access to routes of appeal.
In order to prepare the ground for the new system, as the noble Baroness, Lady Jones of Whitchurch, said, we have set up 20 pathfinders, covering 31 local authority areas and their health service partners. These pathfinders are testing out many of the proposals set out in the Green Paper, such as education, health and care plans and the local offer. I listened to the points made by the noble Baroness about some of the practical concerns, and I agree that my department will need to reflect on them and take them into account as the proposals are taken forward. We will publish an interim report later in the autumn, and we will work with a range of different services to take the lessons on board.
We are also keen to make progress with the Bill in order to get the new system in place. We plan to publish draft SEN clauses for the proposed children and families Bill in the first week of September. A period of consultation and pre-legislative scrutiny will follow before the Bill is introduced to Parliament in spring 2013. That will provide an opportunity to pick up on some of these practical issues. Subject to the approval of Parliament, we hope that the Bill will gain Royal Assent in spring 2014.
One of the recurring themes this afternoon has been the importance of early identification. Here we are taking action on a number of fronts. We are, for example, recruiting and training an additional 4,200 health visitors by 2015, and identifying whether a
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We are also working to bring together the early years progress check at age two in the new early years foundation stage with the healthy child programme health and development review at age two to two and a half. That picks up on a point made by my noble friend Lady Walmsley. Our long-term ambition is to develop one properly integrated health and early years review to support children's development, drawing on the expertise and professionalism of both the early years and the health workforce.
We are working with the Department of Health to see how we can best achieve this. We have asked Jean Gross, the former communications champion for children and young people, to lead a group exploring ways of improving that information sharing, and are expecting findings from that in October this year. Our aim is that the new integrated track, bringing these two aspects together, will be introduced in 2015, when the additional health visitors to whom I have just referred have been recruited.
A number of noble Lords raised the issue of reading difficulties. My noble friend Lady Walmsley mentioned the phonic screening check, the first of which was carried out earlier this month. It will help to identify pupils who have not met the expected standard in phonic decoding, and schools will then be expected to provide appropriate support to help them make good progress and master these essential early reading skills. I think it was alluded to this afternoon that it was the Rose review that underlined the benefits of systematic synthetic phonics for teaching those with dyslexia.
There is also some evidence that schools are getting better at identifying children with autism. The department has been collecting data on the number of children with different types of SEN who either have statements or are on school action plus. The statistics show that, in 2004, 31,000 pupils were identified as having an autistic spectrum disorder. This had risen to 61,500 in 2011, which seems to suggest that there is a greater recognition of autism in the education system. However, there is still a need to recognise and diagnose autism earlier, and we certainly expect local areas to take account of guidelines that are available, such as the National Institute for Health and Clinical Excellence's guidelines on the identification and diagnosis of autism.
I will say a few words about early language, an issue raised by the noble Lord, Lord Ramsbotham. In March, the Government announced an early language development programme to train practitioners to help children up to five years old, particularly those with SEN, by focusing on improving communication and language skills. The programme will help the most disadvantaged children with a special focus on the under-threes, who are at risk of language delay. The new early years foundation stage framework, which my honourable friend Sarah Teather has been working on and which is to be introduced in September this year, will also make a number of improvements. There
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That takes me to the importance of teachers and training, which is one of the recurring issues. My noble friend Lord Storey spoke in a very practical way about some of the steps that a school takes in dealing with these issues, which I found helpful, as opposed to some of the more abstract ways in which the issue is explained to me in the department sometimes. We are taking action in a number of ways to improve teachers' skills in identifying and addressing the special educational needs of children and young people. The new standards for qualified-teacher status include a specific focus on meeting the needs of children with special educational needs or those who are disabled, which was a question raised by my noble friend Lady Walmsley. We have launched a scholarship scheme for teachers to improve and extend their knowledge and expertise when working with disabled pupils and those with SEN, including their knowledge in specific impairments. That scheme has already awarded funding to around 400 teachers to undertake specialist postgraduate qualifications.
My noble friend Lady Browning and others also spoke about the importance of teaching assistants having the necessary skills, so we have launched a similar scholarship scheme for the most able support staff working with disabled pupils and those with SEN. That should enable support staff to gain degree-level qualifications to build their skills and expertise, including in specific issues such as dyslexia.
The Teaching Agency has developed advanced-level materials on autism, dyslexia, speech, language and communication difficulties, and behavioural, emotional and social difficulties. We have increased the number of special school placements available for initial teacher training to up to 900 in 2011-12. We have provided funding for up to 9,000 school SENCOs to complete the mandatory higher-level SENCO award, and we are also funding a further 1,000 SENCOs in 2012-13.
Reference was made to the role of the voluntary sector, and we are supporting that sector as well in helping teachers and schools. Through the voluntary and community sector grant programme we have funded the Dyslexia-SpLD Trust, providing £1.4 million over two years, to raise awareness and support parents. We also provided a grant to Dyslexia Action, with the RNIB, to make more than 650 core texts available in a digital format for dyslexic pupils.
In addition, we are funding the Autism Education Trust to develop national standards for those working with autistic children, as well as training at universal, enhanced and specialist levels, and delivering that to at least 5,000 staff across the country.
Perhaps I may say a few words about the Achievement for All programme, which coaches and supports schools in improving the attainment of their pupils with special educational needs. We know that schools using the programme saw children make greater progress in
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We also talked about successful transition into adulthood-an issue referred toin particular by my noble friend Lord Clement-Jones. We are running a trial of supported internships in 15 further education colleges this autumn. We are providing funding over a couple of years to 25 colleges to test different models of post-16 work experience, and 13 of the colleges involved in the trial will be testing models for young people with learning difficulties.
We are consulting on a more flexible approach to study programmes for all 16 to 19 year-olds, which we think will lead to that whole age group getting more valuable skills and qualifications. We are also providing funding to encourage greater partnership working between clusters of independent specialist colleges, FE colleges and schools so that they work together to improve local provision for young people with learning difficulties and disabilities and share expertise and delivery arrangements. We are going to increase the number of clusters further this year.
Furthermore, the Learning and Skills Improvement Service and the National Institute of Adult Continuing Education have launched specialist qualifications for college teachers working with disabled young people. We think that that will improve the expertise in the FE workforce.
I am pleased to say that more young people with learning difficulties are completing apprenticeships. In 2010-11 more than 17,000 people with a learning difficulty or disability successfully completed an apprenticeship, and that figure has increased in each of the past five years. The number of apprentices declaring that they are dyslexic more than doubled between 2005 and 2010. My noble friend Lord Addington will not be surprised to hear that the success rates for apprentices with dyslexia are similar to those of their peers. Almost 70% of apprentices declaring dyslexia succeed at their apprenticeship compared with 75% of those who do not report a learning difficulty.
The Government will issue an action plan later this summer with a number of measures to increase the accessibility of apprenticeships for young people with learning difficulties and disabilities. That will be aimed at colleges and training providers. I know that my noble friend Lord Addington has been discussing that with colleagues of mine. He has offered to help, I
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The noble and learned Lord, Lord Morris of Aberavon, raised the question about exam adjustments. There is a system of exam adjustments in place; schools and colleges can put arrangements in place to provide things like extra time, supervised rest breaks or assisted technologies.
The Youth Contract, which was mentioned by my noble friend Lady Walmsley, should support more than 55,000 16 and 17 year-olds over the next three years. It will certainly benefit those with learning difficulties and disabilities because they are disproportionately represented in this group of young people who are not in education, employment or learning.
The noble Lord, Lord Touhig, raised the important point about accountability. The new exclusions process, to be introduced in September, will provide additional safeguards for pupils with SEN. In particular, there will need to be an SEN expert to provide advice to the independent review panel. On the point about exclusions raised by the noble Lord, Lord Touhig, and my noble friend Lord Clement-Jones, I agree that the statistics clearly show that the groups we are discussing are disproportionately affected by exclusions. The Government's trials, based on an approach pioneered in Cambridgeshire to try to give schools a far greater incentive to tackle the problem at source rather than excluding pupils and leaving it to other people to sort out, are going forward. They had great results in Cambridgeshire. Trials are taking place now in 11 local authorities and 300 volunteer schools, and I hope that that will be part of the solution to tackling exclusion.
The issue of careers was raised by the noble Baroness, Lady Jones of Whitchurch; I know that that is a concern of hers. We have been clear in the guidance that, for the kinds of group that we have been discussing, those with learning difficulties and other disadvantaged groups the expectation is that schools and colleges should provide face-to-face guidance.
That has been a slight canter across the terrain, and I hope noble Lords will forgive me if I have not picked up on everything. If there are some specific points, I will follow them up. However, I hope that what I have said conveys the range of activity that is under way and the extent of the Government's aspirations. As my noble friend Lord Storey and others reminded us, it is easy to forget sometimes just how far we have come. Many people have made that possible over a long period of time, and there is good work to build on.
The fundamental reforms to the system proposed by my honourable friend Sarah Teather is ambitious, but rightly so. I am glad that there is broad support across the House for those reforms, and I hope that they will provide the platform for the further exposition of some of these issues to which the noble Lord, Lord Touhig, referred. I hope also that noble Lords will accept that, in the important area of helping those with hidden disabilities, this Government have been making progress, and I hope that I have shown that we are certainly committed to making more.
Lord Addington: My Lords, in the few moments remaining to me in this debate, I would like to thank all those who have spoken. I could speak again at considerable length, but I do not think that would be wise. The only thing I would say is something that we used to hear from the previous Government when we were in opposition. They used to state, "We have done more"-I think it was in the field of disability-"than any other Government before us". My response was, "Yes, you have, and so you damn well should have". That is also true of this Government now, in this field. If we can leave it, having said that we have made things a little better than they were before, and hopefully a lot better, we will have succeeded. However, we are standing on the shoulders of what has gone before, much of which was good, despite the mistakes, and I hope that we can carry on in that vein. This discussion has demonstrated a degree of consensus that is actually very helpful.
Today there are 800,000 people with dementia in Great Britain, and two-thirds of them are women. Currently only 43 per cent of people with dementia have a formal diagnosis, yet we all know that diagnosis is the key to accessing information, treatment and support services. There will be more than 1 million people with dementia by 2021 in this country. This year alone it will cost us £23 billion. Currently there are 600,000 family carers of people with dementia.
While significant resources are being spent on dementia, they are often being spent inefficiently and in ways that do not meet the needs or aspirations of the people with dementia and their families. Improving services for people with dementia could therefore boost outcomes and also prove cost effective for the taxpayer. Over a million people living with dementia in the United Kingdom by 2021 will present a major challenge as people with dementia are significant users of both health and social care services, and there remains an unacceptable variation across the country in the quality of services and support. Too often, people with dementia are unable to access the support they need and are frequently failed by the current system. Urgent reform of the social care system is needed, along with a real priority attached to dementia, if we are to improve lives.
As a former member of the Public Accounts Committee in the other place, I well remember the 2007 report by the National Audit Office which found that the health and social care response to dementia was inadequate and that spending on dementia, while significant, was poorly used. The Alzheimer's Society 2009 report, Counting the Cost, showed that there was an unacceptable variation in the care of people with dementia in the hospital service. It found that people with dementia were staying in hospital on average a week longer than other people admitted for the same reason. A report for the Department of Health by Professor Banerjee in 2009 estimated that 180,000 people with dementia were being prescribed anti-psychotic drugs but that two-thirds of the prescriptions were inappropriate. Anti-psychotics rob people with dementia of their quality of life and lead to 1,800 deaths a year. In January 2010, the National Audit Office's interim report on dementia found that progress on implementing the national dementia strategy in England had been patchy and had got off to a slow start. The Alzheimer's Society's 2011 report, Support. Stay. Save., found that half of people with dementia were not getting the support they need.
Last March, the Prime Minister's challenge on dementia laid out further key commitments on research, healthcare and dementia-friendly communities. The Queen's Speech in May outlined the Government's plans to introduce a draft Care and Support Bill for England. We are told that the Bill will set out how the Government will modernise care and support law to ensure that local authorities fit their services around the needs, outcomes, experiences and aspirations of the people. We are told that it will build on a personal budget agenda, simplify the laws around social care and improve the way in which people get information about their due entitlements. Dementia plans and strategies are in place in Northern Ireland, Wales and Scotland, all of which emphasise the need to improve awareness, diagnosis and services.
While the vast majority of care for people with dementia is undertaken by family carers, people with dementia frequently use social care services. The current system does not work for the person receiving care, it does not work for the person providing the care and it certainly does not work for the taxpayer. The chronic underfunding of social care over many years has driven down quality, choice and accessibility. Over the past four years, the increased demand for social care has outstripped the increase in expenditure by 9 per cent, and the ability of people with dementia to live well is increasingly under strain. People with dementia are being unfairly penalised by the existence of what is called the dementia tax.
Individuals and families are spending tens of thousands of pounds to access the care they need, while care for people with other medical conditions, such as cancer, is free. The Alzheimer Society's 2008 report, The Dementia Tax, found that people with dementia and their families are willing to make a contribution to the costs of their care. However, they need a fairer deal which protects them against very high costs and which also guarantees the quality of care. Where one lives determines the level of care received, as councils decide locally at what level to start providing support. Across the country,
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People have a limited say over the care they receive. Choice and control is the experience of too few people. Out of two million older people in England with care-related needs, 800,000 receive no formal support at all. The lack of support early in the condition leads to a substantial pressure on long-term care and acute sectors. Some 10% of the respondents to the survey Support. Stay. Save. reported that the person with dementia was admitted earlier than expected into long-term care because of inadequate support in the community early on. A similar proportion reported that the person with dementia was admitted to hospital when it could have been avoided because there was lack of early support in the community. This is despite evidence that early intervention is both cost-effective and is what people with dementia and their carers want. The care paid for by local authorities is too often provided to people who have significant need when evidence shows that investing in care earlier would reduce demands on the National Health Service. The Alzheimer's Society has been campaigning for many years for a change in the way we pay for care. The forthcoming social care and support White Paper is an historic opportunity to overhaul our care and support system.
What can we do to make a difference? The Dilnot commission proposed a fair system where no one would lose more than 30% of their assets. That would help. However, without additional government funding, England's social care system will not be fixed. The recent Nuffield Trust report identified a number of funding options that could release funds to invest in the social care system. The Government must begin a public debate on where money for care could come from. Money intended for social care must be used for care, and not for filling in potholes. At present, each local authority decides which of the four levels of fair access to care services eligibility criteria they will fund: low, moderate, substantial or critical. It is profoundly unfair that two people living either side of a local authority boundary-they could be living either side of a road-could be entitled to significantly different levels of care. The Government must introduce a national eligibility strategy to improve consistency and fairness across the country. Progress has been made, but we have a long way to go.
Just over two years ago I took part in a march. It was a memorial march in memory of people with dementia who had died. I walked with a man whose wife had not spoken a word in 18 months. He was her carer; he sometimes had respite when his son could take over. His wife was doubly incontinent; they had no shower or toilet facilities on the ground floor. He told me that the only day he was confident that she was kept clean was the day that she went to a day centre, where they had showers, and so forth. He was battling hard in order to find funds to provide these basic facilities on the ground floor of his home. I came away full of despair after talking to that man. I am sure that noble Lords must have had similar encounters.
When we last considered this subject, in a debate introduced by the noble Baroness, Lady Murphy, in 2009, she told us that the average age of your Lordships was 68 and that one third of us will die with dementia. That brings it home that every one of us must know or will have an encounter with someone who has dementia. We really must do something about it. We have a duty to those in our society who are desperately locked away almost as prisoners of illnesses of the mind. It is down to those of us who can still articulate and make the case to ensure that the Government and we as a society do something to improve the quality of life for people with dementia.
Baroness Barker: My Lords, I thank the noble Lord, Lord Touhig, for enabling us to hold this debate and for his eloquent and moving introduction. I confess that I am a veteran of pretty much every one of our debates in this House over the past 10 years. We have had dementia strategies and dementia plans, and I congratulate the previous Government on their work on those important documents, which have moved us forward. Dementia is something that affected my family until last December, when my mum died having, in her words, "kind of lost the place a little bit". That was her euphemistic way of talking about dementia. It is a subject that for the past 20 years I have followed with a great deal of interest because, as noble Lords know, I work with older people.
I want to sound a somewhat more hopeful note than did the noble Lord, Lord Touhig, and I do so because two or three things have happened that give cause for optimism. Building on the work of people like the noble Baroness, Lady Greengross, and the all-party parliamentary group, as well as on important reports from Alzheimer's bodies, the Prime Minister's Challenge on Dementia and the updated dementia strategy are extremely good documents because they move us forward. Not only are they forward-looking, they are quite detailed. The strategy talks not just in broad terms about the need for more research and support, but it begins to draw down different areas in order to achieve a series of things which, over the next five years, will bring about real and actual change in both communities and the health service. They will be of benefit to people who have dementia and their carers.
The Prime Minister's Challenge on Dementia is based on three things: raising awareness and understanding, early diagnosis and support, and enabling people to live well. There is a commitment to increase research funding to the unprecedented level of £66 million, some of which is to be spent in social care, which is extremely helpful. Some of the money will be spent on redesigning services in the health service, but some will also go to the Medical Research Council for further research into brain scanning. We are beginning to move away from broad strategies into more targeted and focused areas. I was pleased to see that resources are to be devoted to developing dementia-friendly communities. That is not jargon. People are starting to work towards a definition of what that is all about.
For more than 20 years I have followed the work of the Dementia Services Development Centre at Stirling University, both under its previous director and now under Professor June Andrews. It has contributed more than any other organisation to the understanding of dementia as an illness, to understanding the needs of carers, and to enabling academics and healthcare professionals to move forward. Recently, Professor Andrews gave a talk about design. She and her colleagues had been involved in a community pilot study in the Forth Valley. People from various disciplines worked for a year to see how, within their existing resources, they could manage things differently. I was pleased to see that not just the health service but organisations like the police, libraries, churches and the general public felt more confident in their ability to deal and interact with people who have dementia. We are getting close to the point where a diagnosis of dementia is not going to lead to older people and their carers automatically being cut off from the life they enjoyed previously and which, for many years to come, may still have some meaning for them.
Professor Andrews talked about the issue of design, and particularly design in people's homes. I am very pleased that some of the people involved in the Prime Minister's challenge are designers and private companies, looking at how they can respond in practical ways to the challenge of dementia. Professor Andrews also talked about the need to develop things like glass-fronted fridges so that people know that they have food. I look forward to the time when homes have glass-fronted freezers because I stopped counting the times that I had to throw away a freezer's worth of food because my mum forgot about it and it went bad. Design, lighting and so on in people's homes can make a tremendous difference to their ability to remember.
I want to focus on one particular area that has not been mentioned so far. Many older people with dementia also have other disabilities. If you are a carer supporting somebody and you try to find out about adaptations, they will be designed for a particular physical disability and not for someone who has a physical disability and also dementia. In this hopeful time, designers could look at the potential to design appliances for the home for people who have the multiple disabilities that most older people will develop.
One particular area we should focus on is telecommunications. It is great that there is enormous change going on in the world of telecommunications and that, for example, phones can now be used by people with hearing disabilities who could not use one before. Yet there is absolutely no point in having a phone that has wonderful functionality if you cannot learn to use it. Professor Andrews made an important point about the ability of people to design things in future that will have new functionality but will look like the objects that people with dementia remember-retro-designing things so that people can continue to use them.
I am also pleased that in the dementia challenge we are finally recognising that in future all health and social care professionals, whatever their discipline, will deal with people who have dementia. That will include dentists, pharmacists and others. We are now moving
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