House of Lords Journal 236 (Session 2002-03)


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Page 79

2002-03

Volume 236      

Thursday 12 December 2002

The House met at eleven o’clock.

The following Lords Spiritual and Temporal were present:

Irvine of Lairg, L.
(Lord Chancellor)

Ackner, L.
Addington, L.
Ahmed, L.
Alderdice, L.
Allenby of Megiddo, V.
Ampthill, L.
Anelay of St Johns, B.
Archer of Sandwell, L.
Arran, E.
Ashley of Stoke, L.
Astor, V.
Astor of Hever, L.
Avebury, L.
Barber of Tewkesbury, L.
Barker, B.
Barnett, L.
Bassam of Brighton, L.
Beaumont of Whitley, L.
Best, L.
Billingham, B.
Bingham of Cornhill, L.
Blackstone, B.
Blatch, B.
Blease, L.
Bledisloe, V.
Blood, B.
Boardman, L.
Boothroyd, B.
Borrie, L.
Boston of Faversham, L.
Brabazon of Tara, L.
Bradshaw, L.
Bragg, L.
Bramall, L.
Brennan, L.
Bridges, L.
Brightman, L.
Brooke of Alverthorpe, L.
Brooke of Sutton Mandeville, L.
Brookman, L.
Brooks of Tremorfa, L.
Brougham and Vaux, L.
Bruce of Donington, L.
Burlison, L.
Burnham, L.
Burns, L.
Buscombe, B.
Butler of Brockwell, L.
Byford, B.
Caithness, E.
Campbell of Alloway, L.
Campbell of Croy, L.
Campbell-Savours, L.
Carey of Clifton, L.
Carlile of Berriew, L.
Carnegy of Lour, B.
Carter, L.
Chorley, L.
Christopher, L.
Clark of Windermere, L.
Clarke of Hampstead, L.
Clement-Jones, L.
Clinton-Davis, L.
Cobbold, L.
Cockfield, L.
Cohen of Pimlico, B.
Colville of Culross, V.
Colwyn, L.
Condon, L.
Cope of Berkeley, L.
Corbett of Castle Vale, L.
Courtown, E.
Cox, B.
Craig of Radley, L.
Craigavon, V.
Crathorne, L.
Crawley, B.
Crickhowell, L.
Croham, L.
Cuckney, L.
Cumberlege, B.
Currie of Marylebone, L.
Dahrendorf, L.
David, B.
Davies of Coity, L.
Davies of Oldham, L.
Dean of Harptree, L.
Dean of Thornton-le-Fylde, B.
Denham, L.
Desai, L.
Dholakia, L.
Dixon, L.
Dixon-Smith, L.
Donaldson of Lymington, L.
Donoughue, L.
Dormand of Easington, L.
Dubs, L.
Dundee, E.
Eatwell, L.
Eccles of Moulton, B.
Elder, L.
Elles, B.
Elliott of Morpeth, L.
Elton, L.
Erroll, E.
Evans of Parkside, L.
Evans of Temple Guiting, L.
Ezra, L.
Falconer of Thoroton, L.
Falkland, V.
Farrington of Ribbleton, B.
Faulkner of Worcester, L.
Feldman, L.
Ferrers, E.
Finlay of Llandaff, B.
Fitt, L.
Flather, B.
Fookes, B.
Fowler, L.
Fraser of Carmyllie, L.
Freeman, L.
Freyberg, L.
Fyfe of Fairfield, L.
Gale, B.
Gardner of Parkes, B.
Garel-Jones, L.
Geddes, L.
Geraint, L.
Gibson of Market Rasen, B.
Gilmour of Craigmillar, L.
Gladwin of Clee, L.
Glentoran, L.
Golding, B.
Goldsmith, L.
Goodhart, L.
Goudie, B.
Graham of Edmonton, L.
Gray of Contin, L.
Greaves, L.
Greengross, B.
Greenway, L.
Grenfell, L.
Griffiths of Fforestfach, L.
Grocott, L.
Guildford, Bp.
Hamwee, B.
Hanham, B.
Hanningfield, L.
Hardy of Wath, L.
Harris of Haringey, L.
Harris of Richmond, B.
Harrison, L.
Hayhoe, L.
Hayman, B.
Healey, L.
Henley, L.
Higgins, L.
Hilton of Eggardon, B.
Hodgson of Astley Abbotts, L.
Hogg of Cumbernauld, L.
Hollis of Heigham, B.
Holme of Cheltenham, L.
Hooper, B.
Hooson, L.
Hope of Craighead, L.
Howe, E.
Howe of Aberavon, L.
Howell of Guildford, L.
Howells of St. Davids, B.
Howie of Troon, L.
Hoyle, L.
Hughes of Woodside, L.
Hunt of Chesterton, L.
Hunt of Kings Heath, L.
Hunt of Wirral, L.
Hussey of North Bradley, L.
Hylton, L.

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Islwyn, L.
Jacobs, L.
Janner of Braunstone, L.
Jay of Paddington, B.
Jeger, B.
Jellicoe, E.
Jenkin of Roding, L.
Jones, L.
Jopling, L.
Jordan, L.
Judd, L.
Kennedy of The Shaws, B.
Kimball, L.
King of Bridgwater, L.
King of West Bromwich, L.
Kirkhill, L.
Knight of Collingtree, B.
Laird, L.
Lamont of Lerwick, L.
Lang of Monkton, L.
Lea of Crondall, L.
Lester of Herne Hill, L.
Lipsey, L.
Listowel, E.
Liverpool, E.
Livsey of Talgarth, L.
Lloyd of Berwick, L.
Lloyd-Webber, L.
Lofthouse of Pontefract, L.
London, Bp.
Lucas, L.
Luke, L.
Lyell, L.
McColl of Dulwich, L.
Macdonald of Tradeston, L.
MacGregor of Pulham Market, L.
McIntosh of Haringey, L.
MacKenzie of Culkein, L.
Mackenzie of Framwellgate, L.
Mackie of Benshie, L.
Maclennan of Rogart, L.
McNally, L.
Maddock, B.
Maginnis of Drumglass, L.
Mancroft, L.
Mar and Kellie, E.
Marlesford, L.
Marsh, L.
Masham of Ilton, B.
Mason of Barnsley, L.
Massey of Darwen, B.
Mayhew of Twysden, L.
Merlyn-Rees, L.
Miller of Chilthorne Domer, B.
Miller of Hendon, B.
Milner of Leeds, L.
Mishcon, L.
Mitchell, L.
Molyneaux of Killead, L.
Monro of Langholm, L.
Monson, L.
Montagu of Beaulieu, L.
Morgan, L.
Morris of Aberavon, L.
Morris of Manchester, L.
Moser, L.
Murray of Epping Forest, L.
Murton of Lindisfarne, L.
Naseby, L.
Newton of Braintree, L.
Nicholls of Birkenhead, L.
Nicholson of Winterbourne, B.
Nicol, B.
Noakes, B.
Northbourne, L.
Northbrook, L.
Northesk, E.
Northover, B.
Oakeshott of Seagrove Bay, L.
O’Cathain, B.
Oppenheim-Barnes, B.
Ouseley, L.
Palmer, L.
Park of Monmouth, B.
Patel, L.
Patel of Blackburn, L.
Patten, L.
Paul, L.
Pearson of Rannoch, L.
Peel, E.
Pendry, L.
Perry of Southwark, B.
Perry of Walton, L.
Peston, L.
Peterborough, Bp.
Peyton of Yeovil, L.
Phillips of Sudbury, L.
Pilkington of Oxenford, L.
Pitkeathley, B.
Plant of Highfield, L.
Plumb, L.
Plummer of St. Marylebone, L.
Ponsonby of Shulbrede, L.
Prashar, B.
Prior, L.
Puttnam, L.
Quirk, L.
Radice, L.
Ramsay of Cartvale, B.
Randall of St. Budeaux, L.
Rawlings, B.
Razzall, L.
Rea, L.
Redesdale, L.
Rees, L.
Rees-Mogg, L.
Rendell of Babergh, B.
Rennard, L.
Renton, L.
Roberts of Conwy, L.
Rogan, L.
Rogers of Riverside, L.
Roll of Ipsden, L.
Rooker, L.
Roper, L.
Rotherwick, L.
Russell-Johnston, L.
Ryder of Wensum, L.
St. John of Bletso, L.
St. John of Fawsley, L.
Saltoun of Abernethy, Ly.
Sandwich, E.
Sawyer, L.
Scotland of Asthal, B.
Seccombe, B.
Selborne, E.
Selsdon, L.
Sewel, L.
Shaw of Northstead, L.
Sheldon, L.
Shutt of Greetland, L.
Simon, V.
Simon of Glaisdale, L.
Simon of Highbury, L.
Skelmersdale, L.
Skidelsky, L.
Smith of Clifton, L.
Smith of Gilmorehill, B.
Southwark, Bp.
Stern, B.
Stevens of Ludgate, L.
Stewartby, L.
Stoddart of Swindon, L.
Stone of Blackheath, L.
Strabolgi, L.
Strange, B.
Strathclyde, L.
Sutherland of Houndwood, L.
Swinfen, L.
Taverne, L.
Taylor of Blackburn, L.
Taylor of Warwick, L.
Tebbit, L.
Temple-Morris, L.
Tenby, V.
Thomas of Gwydir, L.
Thomas of Walliswood, B.
Thomson of Monifieth, L.
Thornton, B.
Tomlinson, L.
Tope, L.
Tordoff, L.
Trefgarne, L.
Trumpington, B.
Turnberg, L.
Turner of Camden, B.
Uddin, B.
Vincent of Coleshill, L.
Waddington, L.
Wade of Chorlton, L.
Wakeham, L.
Walker of Doncaster, L.
Walker of Gestingthorpe, L.
Walmsley, B.
Walpole, L.
Warner, L.
Warnock, B.
Warwick of Undercliffe, B.
Weatherill, L.
Wedderburn of Charlton, L.
Whitaker, B.
Whitty, L.
Wigoder, L.
Wilberforce, L.
Wilcox, B.
Wilkins, B.
Williams of Crosby, B.
Williams of Elvel, L.
Williams of Mostyn, L.
Williamson of Horton, L.
Worcester, Bp.
Wright of Richmond, L.

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PRAYERS were read by the Lord Bishop of Guildford.

Papers

1.Command Papers—The following papers were presented to the House by command of Her Majesty and ordered to lie on the Table:
1.Crime—Criminal Statistics for England and Wales for 2001;
 (5696)
2.Departmental Performance—Autumn Performance Report 2002 of the Department for Culture, Media and Sport;
 (5699)
3.International Labour Conference—Convention and Recommendation adopted at the 89th session of the International Labour Conference and the proposed Government action thereon;
 (5703)
4.Agriculture—Government Response to the Report of the Policy Commission on the Future of Farming and Food.
 (5709)
2.Affirmative Instrument—The following instrument was laid before the House for approval by resolution and ordered to lie on the Table:

Draft Scotland Act 1998 (Transfer of Functions to the Scottish Ministers etc.) Order 2003, laid under the Scotland Act 1998, together with an Explanatory Memorandum.

3.Negative Instruments—The following instruments were laid before the House and ordered to lie on the Table:
1.School Companies Regulations 2002, laid under the Education Act 2002;
 (2978)
2.Education (Bursaries for School Teacher Training) (England) (Revocation) Regulations 2002, laid under the Education (No. 2) Act 1986;
 (3005)
3.European Communities (Rights against Insurers) Regulations 2002, laid under the European Communities Act 1972.
 (3061)
4.Papers not subject to parliamentary proceedings—The following papers were laid before the House and ordered to lie on the Table:
1.Report and Accounts for 2002 of the Human Fertilisation and Embryology Authority, laid under the Human Fertilisation and Embryology Act 1990;
2.Review for 2001 of the Registrar General on births and patterns of family building in England and Wales, laid under the Registration Service Act 1953;
3.Statistics for 2001 of Scientific Procedures on Living Animals in Northern Ireland, laid under the Animals (Scientific Procedures) Act 1986.

Public Business

5.Consolidated Fund Bill—It was moved by the Lord McIntosh of Haringey that the bill be now read a second time; the motion was agreed to and the Committee was negatived.
6.Consolidated Fund (Appropriation) Bill—It was moved by the Lord McIntosh of Haringey that the bill be now read a second time; the motion was agreed to and the Committee was negatived.
7.Licensing Bill [HL]—The House resolved itself into a Committee upon the bill; amendments were moved and (by leave of the Committee) withdrawn; the House was resumed.

The House was adjourned during pleasure.
The House was resumed.

Judicial Business

8.Her Majesty’s Attorney General (Appellant) v. Punch Limited and another (Respondent)—It was moved by the Lord Nicholls of Birkenhead, That the 6th Report from the Appellate Committee be agreed to; the motion was agreed to. It was ordered and adjudged that the Order of the Court of Appeal of 23rd March 2001 be set aside and that the Order of Mr Justice Silber of 7th November 2000 be restored; and that the respondent do pay to the appellant his costs in the Court of Appeal and before this House, the amount of such last-mentioned costs to be certified by the Clerk of the Parliaments if not agreed between the parties. [2002] UKHL 50
9.Assicurazioni Generali SpA (Respondents) v. Arab Insurance Group (BSC) (Petitioners)—The petition of Arab Insurance Group (BSC) praying for leave to appeal was presented and referred to an Appeal Committee.
10.Pearce (Appellant) v. Governing Body of Mayfield School (Respondents)—The petition of the Secretary of State for Trade and Industry praying for leave to intervene in the said appeal was presented and referred to an Appeal Committee.

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11.Thomson (Respondent) v. Kvaerner Govan Limited (Appellants) (Scotland)—The petition of the appellants praying that the time for lodging the statement and appendix and setting down the cause for hearing might be extended to 24th December next or to the third sitting day after the next ensuing meeting of the House (the agents for the respondent consenting thereto) was presented; and it was ordered as prayed (lodged 3rd December).

The House was adjourned during pleasure.
The House was resumed.

Public Business

12.Licensing Bill [HL]—The House again resolved itself into a Committee upon the bill; amendments were moved and (by leave of the Committee) withdrawn; an amendment was disagreed to (see division list); the House was resumed after amendment 65.

The House was adjourned at twenty-seven minutes past seven o’clock
to Monday next, half-past two o’clock.


LICENSING BILL [HL]

It was moved by the Baroness Buscombe, in Schedule 1, page 109, line 12, after “boxing” to insert “, martial arts”; which being objected to, the question was put thereupon, and the Committee divided:

Contents..............59

Not-Contents..............63

CONTENTS

Allenby of Megiddo, V.
Astor of Hever, L.
Blatch, B.
Brightman, L.
Brooke of Sutton Mandeville, L.
Brougham and Vaux, L.
Buscombe, B.
Caithness, E.
Campbell of Alloway, L.
Carnegy of Lour, B.
Chorley, L.
Cobbold, L.
Cope of Berkeley, L. [Teller]
Craig of Radley, L.
Craigavon, V.
Croham, L.
Cumberlege, B.
Denham, L.
Dixon-Smith, L.
Dundee, E.
Elliott of Morpeth, L.
Elton, L.
Ferrers, E.
Gardner of Parkes, B.
Garel-Jones, L.
Hanham, B.
Hayhoe, L.
Hodgson of Astley Abbotts, L.
Howe, E.
Howe of Aberavon, L.
Jenkin of Roding, L.
Liverpool, E.
Luke, L.
Lyell, L.
McColl of Dulwich, L.
Mancroft, L.
Marlesford, L.
Mayhew of Twysden, L.
Monson, L.
Naseby, L.
Noakes, B.
O’Cathain, B.
Oppenheim-Barnes, B.
Park of Monmouth, B.
Perry of Southwark, B.
Plumb, L.
Renton, L.
Ryder of Wensum, L.
Seccombe, B. [Teller]
Selsdon, L.
Skelmersdale, L.
Strange, B.
Tenby, V.
Thomas of Gwydir, L.
Trumpington, B.
Wakeham, L.
Weatherill, L.
Wilcox, B.
Williamson of Horton, L.

NOT-CONTENTS

Addington, L.
Ahmed, L.
Alderdice, L.
Ampthill, L.
Archer of Sandwell, L.
Avebury, L.
Barker, B.
Bassam of Brighton, L.
Beaumont of Whitley, L.
Billingham, B.
Blackstone, B.
Brooke of Alverthorpe, L.
Campbell-Savours, L.
Carter, L.
Clarke of Hampstead, L.
Clement-Jones, L.
Clinton-Davis, L.
Crawley, B.
Davies of Oldham, L.
Desai, L.
Dholakia, L.
Dormand of Easington, L.
Dubs, L.
Eatwell, L.
Elder, L.
Evans of Temple Guiting, L.
Falconer of Thoroton, L.
Falkland, V.
Farrington of Ribbleton, B.
Faulkner of Worcester, L.
Gibson of Market Rasen, B.
Goldsmith, L.
Goodhart, L.
Graham of Edmonton, L.
Greaves, L.
Grenfell, L.
Grocott, L. [Teller]
Hardy of Wath, L.
Harris of Richmond, B.
Hayman, B.
Hilton of Eggardon, B.
Hollis of Heigham, B.
Holme of Cheltenham, L.
Howells of St. Davids, B.
Howie of Troon, L.
Hoyle, L.
Hunt of Kings Heath, L.
Irvine of Lairg, L.
(Lord Chancellor)
Janner of Braunstone, L.
Jeger, B.
Jordan, L.
Judd, L.
Lea of Crondall, L.

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Livsey of Talgarth, L.
McIntosh of Haringey, L. [Teller]
MacKenzie of Culkein, L.
Mackenzie of Framwellgate, L.
Massey of Darwen, B.
Merlyn-Rees, L.
Milner of Leeds, L.
Mishcon, L.
Morgan, L.
Oakeshott of Seagrove Bay, L.
Pendry, L.
Pitkeathley, B.
Ponsonby of Shulbrede, L.
Ramsay of Cartvale, B.
Randall of St. Budeaux, L.
Razzall, L.
Redesdale, L.
Rendell of Babergh, B.
Rennard, L.
Rogers of Riverside, L.
Rooker, L.
Roper, L.
Russell-Johnston, L.
Scotland of Asthal, B.
Sewel, L.
Simon, V.
Taverne, L.
Thomas of Walliswood, B.
Thomson of Monifieth, L.
Thornton, B.
Tope, L.
Turner of Camden, B.
Walmsley, B.
Warwick of Undercliffe, B.
Whitaker, B.
Whitty, L.
Wilkins, B.
Williams of Crosby, B.
Williams of Elvel, L.
Williams of Mostyn, L.
(Lord Privy Seal)