House of Lords Journal 233 (Session 1999-00)


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Page 690

1999-00

Volume 233      

Tuesday 3 October 2000

The House met at half-past two o’clock.

The following Lords Spiritual and Temporal were present:

Irvine of Lairg, L.
(Lord Chancellor)

Ackner, L.
Acton, L.
Addington, L.
Ahmed, L.
Alexander of Weedon, L.
Allenby of Megiddo, V.
Alli, L.
Alton of Liverpool, L.
Amos, B.
Ampthill, L.
Andrews, B.
Anelay of St. Johns, B.
Archer of Sandwell, L.
Arran, E.
Ashley of Stoke, L.
Attlee, E.
Avebury, L.
Bach, L.
Baker of Dorking, L.
Barber, L.
Barnett, L.
Bassam of Brighton, L.
Beaumont of Whitley, L.
Berkeley, L.
Bernstein of Craigweil, L.
Biffen, L.
Billingham, B.
Blackburn, Bp.
Blackstone, B.
Blaker, L.
Blatch, B.
Blease, L.
Bledisloe, V.
Blood, B.
Boardman, L.
Borrie, L.
Boston of Faversham, L.
Bowness, L.
Brabazon of Tara, L.
Bradford, Bp.
Bragg, L.
Brennan, L.
Brett, L.
Bridgeman, V.
Bridges, L.
Brightman, L.
Bristol, Bp.
Brookman, L.
Brooks of Tremorfa, L.
Brougham and Vaux, L.
Bruce of Donington, L.
Burlison, L.
Burnham, L.
Butterworth, L.
Byford, B.
Caithness, E.
Campbell of Alloway, L.
Campbell of Croy, L.
Canterbury, Abp.
Carnarvon, E.
Carnegy of Lour, B.
Carrington, L.
Carter, L.
Chalfont, L.
Chandos, V.
Christopher, L.
Clark of Kempston, L.
Clarke of Hampstead, L.
Cledwyn of Penrhos, L.
Clinton-Davis, L.
Clyde, L.
Cockfield, L.
Cocks of Hartcliffe, L.
Cohen of Pimlico, B.
Colville of Culross, V.
Colwyn, L.
Cope of Berkeley, L.
Courtown, E.
Craig of Radley, L.
Craigavon, V.
Cranborne, V.
Crathorne, L.
Crawley, B.
Currie of Marylebone, L.
Dahrendorf, L.
Darcy de Knayth, B.
David, B.
Davies of Oldham, L.
Dean of Thornton-le-Fylde, B.
Denham, L.
Desai, L.
Dholakia, L.
Dixon, L.
Dixon-Smith, L.
Donoughue, L.
Dormand of Easington, L.
Dubs, L.
Eatwell, L.
Eden of Winton, L.
Elder, L.
Elis-Thomas, L.
Elles, B.
Elliott of Morpeth, L.
Elton, L.
Emerton, B.
Erroll, E.
Evans of Parkside, L.
Evans of Temple Guiting, L.
Evans of Watford, L.
Ezra, L.
Falconer of Thoroton, L.
Falkland, V.
Farrington of Ribbleton, B.
Faulkner of Worcester, L.
Ferrers, E.
Filkin, L.
Fitt, L.
Flather, B.
Fookes, B.
Fraser of Carmyllie, L.
Freeman, L.
Freyberg, L.
Fyfe of Fairfield, L.
Gale, B.
Gardner of Parkes, B.
Gibson, L.
Gibson of Market Rasen, B.
Gilbert, L.
Gilmour of Craigmillar, L.
Gladwin of Clee, L.
Glenarthur, L.
Glentoran, L.
Goldsmith, L.
Goodhart, L.
Gordon of Strathblane, L.
Goschen, V.
Goudie, B.
Gould of Potternewton, B.
Graham of Edmonton, L.
Gray of Contin, L.
Greaves, L.
Greengross, B.
Greenway, L.
Gregson, L.
Grenfell, L.
Hamwee, B.
Hanson, L.
Harris of Greenwich, L.
Harris of Haringey, L.
Harris of Richmond, B.
Harrison, L.
Haskel, L.
Hayhoe, L.
Hayman, B.
Henley, L.
Hereford, Bp.
Hilton of Eggardon, B.
Hoffmann, L.
Hollis of Heigham, B.
Holme of Cheltenham, L.
Home, E.
Hooper, B.
Hooson, L.
Howell of Guildford, L.
Howells of St. Davids, B.
Howie of Troon, L.
Hoyle, L.
Hughes of Woodside, L.
Hunt of Chesterton, L.
Hunt of Kings Heath, L.
Hunt of Wirral, L.
Hurd of Westwell, L.
Islwyn, L.
Jacobs, L.
Jay of Paddington, B.
Jellicoe, E.
Jenkin of Roding, L.
Jenkins of Hillhead, L.
Jenkins of Putney, L.
Jopling, L.

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Judd, L.
Kennedy of The Shaws, B.
Kimball, L.
Kirkham, L.
Kirkhill, L.
Laming, L.
Lamont of Lerwick, L.
Lane of Horsell, L.
Lang of Monkton, L.
Layard, L.
Lea of Crondall, L.
Lester of Herne Hill, L.
Linklater of Butterstone, B.
Lipsey, L.
Listowel, E.
Liverpool, E.
Lloyd of Berwick, L.
Lockwood, B.
Lofthouse of Pontefract, L.
Longford, E.
Lucas, L.
Ludford, B.
Luke, L.
Lyell, L.
McAlpine of West Green, L.
McCarthy, L.
McColl of Dulwich, L.
McConnell, L.
Macdonald of Tradeston, L.
Macfarlane of Bearsden, L.
McIntosh of Haringey, L.
McIntosh of Hudnall, B.
Mackay of Ardbrecknish, L.
Mackenzie of Framwellgate, L.
Mackie of Benshie, L.
MacLaurin of Knebworth, L.
McNally, L.
Maddock, B.
Mallalieu, B.
Mancroft, L.
Mar, C.
Mar and Kellie, E.
Marlesford, L.
Marsh, L.
Masham of Ilton, B.
Mason of Barnsley, L.
Massey of Darwen, B.
Mayhew of Twysden, L.
Methuen, L.
Miller of Chilthorne Domer, B.
Milner of Leeds, L.
Mishcon, L.
Mitchell, L.
Molloy, L.
Molyneaux of Killead, L.
Monson, L.
Montagu of Beaulieu, L.
Montrose, D.
Moran, L.
Mowbray and Stourton, L.
Moynihan, L.
Murton of Lindisfarne, L.
Naseby, L.
Newby, L.
Newton of Braintree, L.
Nicholson of Winterbourne, B.
Nicol, B.
Norfolk, D.
Northbourne, L.
Northbrook, L.
Northesk, E.
Northfield, L.
Northover, B.
Norton of Louth, L.
Oakeshott of Seagrove Bay, L.
O’Cathain, B.
Onslow, E.
Orme, L.
Oxford, Bp.
Oxfuird, V.
Palmer, L.
Park of Monmouth, B.
Parkinson, L.
Patel of Blackburn, L.
Paul, L.
Peel, E.
Perry of Walton, L.
Peston, L.
Phillips of Sudbury, L.
Pilkington of Oxenford, L.
Pitkeathley, B.
Plant of Highfield, L.
Plumb, L.
Plummer of St. Marylebone, L.
Porter of Luddenham, L.
Powell of Bayswater, L.
Prior, L.
Prys-Davies, L.
Quirk, L.
Ramsay of Cartvale, B.
Randall of St. Budeaux, L.
Rawlinson of Ewell, L.
Razzall, L.
Rea, L.
Reay, L.
Redesdale, L.
Rees-Mogg, L.
Rendell of Babergh, B.
Renfrew of Kaimsthorn, L.
Rennard, L.
Renton, L.
Renton of Mount Harry, L.
Renwick of Clifton, L.
Richard, L.
Richardson of Calow, B.
Rix, L.
Roberts of Conwy, L.
Rodgers of Quarry Bank, L.
Rogers of Riverside, L.
Roll of Ipsden, L.
Roper, L.
Rosslyn, E.
Rotherwick, L.
Ryder of Warsaw, B.
Ryder of Wensum, L.
Sainsbury of Turville, L.
St. John of Bletso, L.
St. John of Fawsley, L.
Sandberg, L.
Sandwich, E.
Sawyer, L.
Scotland of Asthal, B.
Scott of Needham Market, B.
Seccombe, B.
Selborne, E.
Selsdon, L.
Serota, B.
Sharman, L.
Sharp of Guildford, B.
Sharples, B.
Shaw of Northstead, L.
Shepherd, L.
Shore of Stepney, L.
Shrewsbury, E.
Shutt of Greetland, L.
Simon, V.
Simon of Glaisdale, L.
Skelmersdale, L.
Skidelsky, L.
Slim, V.
Smith of Clifton, L.
Smith of Gilmorehill, B.
Smith of Leigh, L.
Soulsby of Swaffham Prior, L.
Stallard, L.
Stevens of Ludgate, L.
Stewartby, L.
Stodart of Leaston, L.
Stone of Blackheath, L.
Strabolgi, L.
Strange, B.
Swinfen, L.
Symons of Vernham Dean, B.
Taylor of Blackburn, L.
Taylor of Gryfe, L.
Taylor of Warwick, L.
Tenby, V.
Thomas of Gwydir, L.
Thornton, B.
Tomlinson, L.
Tordoff, L.
Trefgarne, L.
Trumpington, B.
Turnberg, L.
Turner of Camden, B.
Uddin, B.
Varley, L.
Vinson, L.
Wade of Chorlton, L.
Wakeham, L.
Walker of Doncaster, L.
Wallace of Saltaire, L.
Walmsley, B.
Walpole, L.
Warner, L.
Warwick of Undercliffe, B.
Watson of Richmond, L.
Waverley, V.
Weatherill, L.
Wedderburn of Charlton, L.
Whitaker, B.
Whitty, L.
Wigoder, L.
Wilberforce, L.
Wilcox, B.
Wilkins, B.
Williams of Elvel, L.
Williams of Mostyn, L.
Williamson of Horton, L.
Willoughby de Broke, L.
Woolmer of Leeds, L.
Young of Old Scone, B.

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PRAYERS were read by the Lord Bishop of Bradford.

Judicial Business

1.Director of Public Prosecutions (Respondent) v. Atkins (Petitioner)—The petition of Antony Rowan Atkins praying for an extension of time within which the petition may be lodged and for leave to appeal in accordance with the Administration of Justice Act 1960 was presented and referred to an Appeal Committee.
2.Bank of Credit and Commerce International SA (in compulsory liquidation) (Appellants) v. Ali and others (Respondents)—The petition of the appellants praying that the time for lodging the statement and appendix and setting down the cause for hearing might be extended to 13th October next (the agents for the respondents consenting thereto) was presented; and it was ordered as prayed (lodged 29th September).
3.Bank of Credit and Commerce International SA (in compulsory liquidation) (Appellants) v. Ali and others and another (FC) (Respondents)—The certificate of public funding of Khawaja Naeem was lodged.

Papers

4.Command Papers—The following papers were presented to the House by command of Her Majesty and ordered to lie on the Table:
1.Firearms—Government Reply to the Second Report from the House of Commons Home Affairs Committee “Controls over Firearms”;
 (4864)
2.Science and Technology—Government Response to the Third Report from the Select Committee “Science and Society”.
 (4875)
5.Negative Instruments—The following instruments were laid before the House and ordered to lie on the Table:
1. (i)Prison (Amendment) (No. 2) Rules 2000—(2641)
(ii)Young Offender Institution (Amendment) (No. 3) Rules 2000—(2642)

laid under the Prison Act 1952;

2.Telecommunications (Lawful Business Practice) (Interception of Communications) Regulations 2000, laid under the Regulation of Investigatory Powers Act 2000.
 (2699)
6.Paper not subject to parliamentary proceedings—The following paper was laid before the House and ordered to lie on the Table:

Amendment 10 to the RAF Manual of Assessment of Medical Fitness AP 1269A, laid under the Air Force (Constitution) Act 1917.

Public Business

7.Countryside and Rights of Way Bill—The House again resolved itself into a Committee upon the bill; an amendment was negatived; amendments were disagreed to (see division lists 1, 2 and 3); amendments were moved and (by leave of the Committee) withdrawn; amendments were agreed to; the House was resumed after amendment 212.

The House was adjourned at two minutes before eight o’clock
in the morning of Wednesday 4th October
till later the same day, half-past two o’clock in the afternoon.


DIVISIONS

Division No. 1

COUNTRYSIDE AND RIGHTS OF WAY BILL

It was moved by the Lord Glentoran, in Clause 2, page 2, line 24, at end to insert:

(“( ) before doing so, he informs himself, so far as is reasonably practicable, by means of information provided at designated access points, or otherwise, of any restrictions imposed (under Chapter II) in relation to the land,”);

which being objected to, the question was put thereupon, and the Committee divided:

Contents.............80

Not-Contents.............150

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CONTENTS

Alton of Liverpool, L.
Arran, E.
Biffen, L.
Bledisloe, V.
Boardman, L.
Bridgeman, V.
Bridges, L.
Brougham and Vaux, L.
Burnham, L. [Teller]
Byford, B.
Caithness, E.
Carnarvon, E.
Carnegy of Lour, B.
Clark of Kempston, L.
Craigavon, V.
Darcy de Knayth, B.
Denham, L.
Dixon-Smith, L.
Eden of Winton, L.
Ferrers, E.
Fookes, B.
Gardner of Parkes, B.
Glentoran, L.
Goschen, V.
Gray of Contin, L.
Greenway, L.
Hanson, L.
Hayhoe, L.
Henley, L. [Teller]
Hooper, B.
Jopling, L.
Kimball, L.
Luke, L.
Lyell, L.
McConnell, L.
Mackay of Ardbrecknish, L.
Mancroft, L.
Marlesford, L.
Masham of Ilton, B.
Mayhew of Twysden, L.
Molyneaux of Killead, L.
Monson, L.
Montagu of Beaulieu, L.
Montrose, D.
Moran, L.
Moynihan, L.
Northbourne, L.
Northbrook, L.
Northesk, E.
Norton of Louth, L.
O’Cathain, B.
Onslow, E.
Oxfuird, V.
Palmer, L.
Park of Monmouth, B.
Peel, E.
Pilkington of Oxenford, L.
Plumb, L.
Prior, L.
Rawlinson of Ewell, L.
Reay, L.
Renton, L.
Roberts of Conwy, L.
Rotherwick, L.
Ryder of Wensum, L.
St. John of Bletso, L.
Selborne, E.
Shaw of Northstead, L.
Shrewsbury, E.
Simon of Glaisdale, L.
Soulsby of Swaffham Prior, L.
Stewartby, L.
Stodart of Leaston, L.
Thomas of Gwydir, L.
Trumpington, B.
Weatherill, L.
Wilberforce, L.
Wilcox, B.
Williamson of Horton, L.
Willoughby de Broke, L.

NOT-CONTENTS

Acton, L.
Addington, L.
Ahmed, L.
Allenby of Megiddo, V.
Alli, L.
Amos, B.
Andrews, B.
Ashley of Stoke, L.
Avebury, L.
Bach, L.
Barnett, L.
Bassam of Brighton, L.
Beaumont of Whitley, L.
Berkeley, L.
Bernstein of Craigweil, L.
Billingham, B.
Blackburn, Bp.
Blackstone, B.
Blease, L.
Borrie, L.
Bragg, L.
Brennan, L.
Brookman, L.
Brooks of Tremorfa, L.
Burlison, L.
Carter, L. [Teller]
Christopher, L.
Clarke of Hampstead, L.
Clinton-Davis, L.
Cocks of Hartcliffe, L.
Crawley, B.
Currie of Marylebone, L.
David, B.
Davies of Oldham, L.
Desai, L.
Dholakia, L.
Donoughue, L.
Dormand of Easington, L.
Dubs, L.
Elder, L.
Evans of Parkside, L.
Evans of Temple Guiting, L.
Falconer of Thoroton, L.
Farrington of Ribbleton, B.
Faulkner of Worcester, L.
Filkin, L.
Fitt, L.
Fyfe of Fairfield, L.
Gale, B.
Gibson of Market Rasen, B.
Gilbert, L.
Gladwin of Clee, L.
Goldsmith, L.
Gordon of Strathblane, L.
Goudie, B.
Gould of Potternewton, B.
Graham of Edmonton, L.
Greaves, L.
Grenfell, L.
Hamwee, B.
Harris of Greenwich, L.
Harris of Haringey, L.
Harris of Richmond, B.
Harrison, L.
Haskel, L.
Hayman, B.
Hilton of Eggardon, B.
Hollis of Heigham, B.
Holme of Cheltenham, L.
Hooson, L.
Howie of Troon, L.
Hoyle, L.
Hughes of Woodside, L.
Hunt of Chesterton, L.
Hunt of Kings Heath, L.
Irvine of Lairg, L.
(Lord Chancellor)
Islwyn, L.
Jay of Paddington, B.
(Lord Privy Seal)
Jenkins of Putney, L.
Judd, L.
Kennedy of The Shaws, B.
Kirkhill, L.
Layard, L.
Lea of Crondall, L.
Lipsey, L.
Lockwood, B.
Lofthouse of Pontefract, L.
Longford, E.
McCarthy, L.
Macdonald of Tradeston, L.
McIntosh of Haringey, L. [Teller]
Mackenzie of Framwellgate, L.
Mackie of Benshie, L.
Mallalieu, B.
Mar and Kellie, E.
Mason of Barnsley, L.
Massey of Darwen, B.
Miller of Chilthorne Domer, B.
Milner of Leeds, L.
Mitchell, L.
Molloy, L.
Nicol, B.
Oakeshott of Seagrove Bay, L.
Orme, L.
Peston, L.
Pitkeathley, B.
Plant of Highfield, L.
Prys-Davies, L.
Ramsay of Cartvale, B.
Randall of St. Budeaux, L.
Rea, L.
Rendell of Babergh, B.

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Rennard, L.
Richardson of Calow, B.
Rodgers of Quarry Bank, L.
Rogers of Riverside, L.
Sawyer, L.
Scotland of Asthal, B.
Scott of Needham Market, B.
Serota, B.
Sharp of Guildford, B.
Shore of Stepney, L.
Shutt of Greetland, L.
Simon, V.
Smith of Clifton, L.
Smith of Gilmorehill, B.
Smith of Leigh, L.
Stone of Blackheath, L.
Strabolgi, L.
Taylor of Blackburn, L.
Taylor of Gryfe, L.
Thornton, B.
Tomlinson, L.
Tordoff, L.
Turnberg, L.
Turner of Camden, B.
Uddin, B.
Varley, L.
Walker of Doncaster, L.
Walmsley, B.
Warner, L.
Warwick of Undercliffe, B.
Wedderburn of Charlton, L.
Whitaker, B.
Whitty, L.
Wilkins, B.
Williams of Elvel, L.
Williams of Mostyn, L.
Woolmer of Leeds, L.
Young of Old Scone, B.

Division No. 2

COUNTRYSIDE AND RIGHTS OF WAY BILL

It was moved by the Earl of Caithness, in Clause 3, page 3, line 11, to leave out from beginning to (“any”); which being objected to, the question was put thereupon, and the Committee divided:

Contents.............25

Not-Contents.............66

CONTENTS

Arran, E.
Attlee, E.
Blatch, B.
Burnham, L.
Byford, B.
Caithness, E. [Teller]
Glentoran, L.
Henley, L. [Teller]
Jopling, L.
Kimball, L.
Lamont of Lerwick, L.
Luke, L.
Lyell, L.
Mackay of Ardbrecknish, L.
Mancroft, L.
Marlesford, L.
Montrose, D.
Northbrook, L.
Northesk, E.
Oxfuird, V.
Peel, E.
Rotherwick, L.
Shrewsbury, E.
Skelmersdale, L.
Willoughby de Broke, L.

NOT-CONTENTS

Acton, L.
Addington, L.
Ahmed, L.
Alli, L.
Amos, B.
Bach, L.
Berkeley, L.
Bernstein of Craigweil, L.
Billingham, B.
Brennan, L.
Brett, L.
Brookman, L.
Brooks of Tremorfa, L.
Burlison, L.
Carter, L. [Teller]
Clarke of Hampstead, L.
Desai, L.
Donoughue, L.
Dubs, L.
Elder, L.
Evans of Temple Guiting, L.
Farrington of Ribbleton, B.
Faulkner of Worcester, L.
Gale, B.
Gibson of Market Rasen, B.
Gordon of Strathblane, L.
Gould of Potternewton, B.
Greaves, L.
Grenfell, L.
Hamwee, B.
Harris of Haringey, L.
Hayman, B.
Hollis of Heigham, B.
Hoyle, L.
Hughes of Woodside, L.
Hunt of Chesterton, L.
Hunt of Kings Heath, L.
Jay of Paddington, B.
(Lord Privy Seal)
Judd, L.
Layard, L.
Lea of Crondall, L.
Lipsey, L.
Macdonald of Tradeston, L.
McIntosh of Haringey, L. [Teller]
McIntosh of Hudnall, B.
Mackenzie of Framwellgate, L.
Mar and Kellie, E.
Massey of Darwen, B.
Miller of Chilthorne Domer, B.
Nicol, B.
Patel of Blackburn, L.
Pitkeathley, B.
Ramsay of Cartvale, B.
Rea, L.
Rendell of Babergh, B.
Scotland of Asthal, B.
Smith of Leigh, L.
Stone of Blackheath, L.
Thornton, B.
Turnberg, L.
Turner of Camden, B.
Uddin, B.
Whitty, L.
Williams of Mostyn, L.
Woolmer of Leeds, L.
Young of Old Scone, B.

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Division No. 3

COUNTRYSIDE AND RIGHTS OF WAY BILL

It was moved by the Lord Glentoran in Clause 3, page 3, line 12, at end to insert:

(“( ) An order under this section shall not be made unless the Secretary of State (as respects England) or the National Assembly for Wales (as respects Wales) has consulted those interests likely to be affected by the order, has undertaken and published a regulatory impact assessment in relation to the proposed order, and has undertaken and published an assessment of the effects of a proposal for any such order on—

(a) the environment, including any effects on the natural beauty, flora, fauna and geological and physiographical features of the land affected,

(b) the use and management of land adjacent to the land affected, and

(c) flood and coastal defence and coast protection in relation to the land affected.”);

which is being objected to, the question was put thereupon, and the Committee divided:

Contents.............24

Not-Contents.............65

CONTENTS

Arran, E.
Attlee, E.
Blatch, B.
Burnham, L. [Teller]
Byford, B.
Glentoran, L.
Henley, L. [Teller]
Jopling, L.
Kimball, L.
Lamont of Lerwick, L.
Luke, L.
Lyell, L.
Mackay of Ardbrecknish, L.
Mancroft, L.
Marlesford, L.
Montrose, D.
Northbrook, L.
Northesk, E.
Oxfuird, V.
Peel, E.
Rotherwick, L.
Shrewsbury, E.
Skelmersdale, L.
Willoughby de Broke, L.

NOT-CONTENTS

Acton, L.
Addington, L.
Ahmed, L.
Alli, L.
Amos, B.
Bach, L.
Berkeley, L.
Bernstein of Craigweil, L.
Billingham, B.
Brennan, L.
Brett, L.
Brookman, L.
Brooks of Tremorfa, L.
Burlison, L.
Carter, L. [Teller]
Clarke of Hampstead, L.
Desai, L.
Donoughue, L.
Dubs, L.
Elder, L.
Evans of Temple Guiting, L.
Farrington of Ribbleton, B.
Faulkner of Worcester, L.
Gale, B.
Gibson of Market Rasen, B.
Gordon of Strathblane, L.
Gould of Potternewton, B.
Greaves, L.
Grenfell, L.
Hamwee, B.
Harris of Haringey, L.
Hayman, B.
Hollis of Heigham, B.
Hoyle, L.
Hughes of Woodside, L.
Hunt of Kings Heath, L.
Jay of Paddington, B.
(Lord Privy Seal)
Judd, L.
Layard, L.
Lea of Crondall, L.
Lipsey, L.
Macdonald of Tradeston, L.
McIntosh of Haringey, L. [Teller]
McIntosh of Hudnall, B.
Mackenzie of Framwellgate, L.
Mar and Kellie, E.
Massey of Darwen, B.
Miller of Chilthorne Domer, B.
Nicol, B.
Patel of Blackburn, L.
Pitkeathley, B.
Ramsay of Cartvale, B.
Rea, L.
Rendell of Babergh, B.
Scotland of Asthal, B.
Smith of Leigh, L.
Stone of Blackheath, L.
Thornton, B.
Turnberg, L.
Turner of Camden, B.
Uddin, B.
Whitty, L.
Williams of Mostyn, L.
Woolmer of Leeds, L.
Young of Old Scone, B.