| Asylum and Immigration (Treatment of Claimants, etc.) Bill
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Mr. Turner: I support amendment No. 141 for an additional reason to those mentioned by my hon. Friend the Member for Woking; public interest. My constituents, and people across the country, trust the Home Office to protect the country from unwarranted asylum applications on their behalf. My hon. Friend has provided evidence that the Home Office is falling down on that responsibility and no longer justifies that trust. If legitimate authorities cannot be trusted to do their job, people will turn to other methods. A loss of faith in the Government and other political parties is one reason for people turning to extremist political parties. I am sure that the Minister is aware of that, and it is not necessary for me to lecture the Committee. However, I must underline that people have to trust the Government, and when the Government fail, people lose faith in all of us. Mr. Lammy: Amendment No. 140 would require the procedure rules to make provision for the tribunal to follow an active approach to the hearing of appeals. In principle, there is no reason for tribunals not to follow a more active approach, as long as we continue to guarantee a fair, impartial hearing. The use of the word ''active'' may mean a more inquisitorial and less adversarial approach. We are in favour of reconsidering the nature of hearings for the new tribunal. We have had initial discussions with the judiciary at the immigration appellate authority. No decisions have yet been taken, but we want to ascertain whether there is scope for a more interventionist approach. In moving to a new single tier, it is right that we consider new arrangements, and I am happy to go away and examine that point. I have taken on board what hon. Members have said about amendment No. 141. I understand the importance of a presenting officer being at a hearing, and have met presenting officers and seen them at work in tribunals. We have made some progress in getting Column Number: 321 more presenting officers. Between October and December last year, two thirds of cases had presenting officers, which is progress, and we have recruited and trained 65 extra officers, which will go some way to remedying the situation. I am personally sympathetic to having presenting officers, but adjudicators formerly could and judges now can legally reach their determinations without them. We are attempting to make presenting officers available.Mr. Malins: Will the Minister undertake to instruct counsel where a presenting officer is not available, so that the Home Office is always represented? Mr. Lammy: I cannot make that undertaking, because we have a system in which the judge can reach a determination without the presence of a presenting officer. That happens every day of the week. The Government's view is that it is preferable to have presenting officers where necessary, which is why we have actively sought to recruit 65. We have rightly examined such issues as the recruitment of presenting Column Number: 322 officers, the sorts of people who want to be presenting officers—such as those not getting pupillage—the salary and so on.We have made active attempts to recruit people. We have the extra 65 presenting officers and as of December there was representation on two thirds of cases, so we have gone some way to meeting the hon. Member for Woking's point. He makes a good point, to which the Government are sympathetic, but we do not see the need to put that obligation in statute, because it would not deal with recruitment. For that reason I am unable to accept the amendment. Mr. Malins: The Minister, perhaps not unnaturally, cannot accept the amendment, but he understands the force behind the arguments, which is just enough for me on this occasion. I beg to ask leave to withdraw the amendment. Amendment, by leave, withdrawn. Schedule 2, as amended, agreed to. Further consideration adjourned.—[Mr. Heppell.]
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Roe, Mrs. Marion (Chairman) Bacon, Mr. Blizzard, Mr. Curtis-Thomas, Mrs. Ewing, Annabelle Gardiner, Mr. Garnier, Mr. Gerrard, Mr. Harris, Mr. Tom Heath, Mr. Heppell, Mr. Column Number: 324 Hughes, Beverley Jones, Mr. Jon Owen Lammy, Mr. McWalter, Mr. Malins, Mr. Oaten, Mr. Prosser, Mr. Taylor, Ms Dari Turner, Mr. Andrew Watkinson, Angela Williams, Mrs. Betty
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| Prepared 20 January 2004 | |
