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Session 2000-01
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House of Commons Votes and Proceedings
Wednesday 2nd May 2001

The House met at half-past Two o'clock.

PRAYERS.

1    Standing Orders (Private Business),-Ordered, That the Amendments to Standing Orders set out in the Schedule be made, with effect from 27th November 2001:-

SCHEDULE

    Standing Order 1, line 46 at end insert -

      'the term "minister of the Crown" means the holder of an office in Her Majesty's government in the United Kingdom and includes the Treasury;'.

    Standing Order 38, line 15, at end insert -

      '(2A) The printed memorandum shall include a statement of opinion, by or on behalf of the promoters, as to the compatibility of the provisions of the bill with the Convention rights (as defined in the Human Rights Act 1998).'

    Standing Order 39, line 6, after 'Treasury,' insert 'the Privy Council Office,'.

    Standing Order 85, line 6, at end insert-

      '(2) Without prejudice to the generality of paragraph (1) of this standing order, where in the case of a private bill which has been read a first time no report from a minister of the Crown has been presented to the House under Standing Order 169A, the Chairman of Ways and Means may, if he thinks fit, direct the attention of the House to that fact.'

    Standing Order 144, leave out lines 12 to 15

    Standing Order 158, line 16, at end insert -

      '(by being deposited in the Private Bill Office)'.-(The Chairman of Ways and Means.)

2     Standing Orders (Private Business),-Ordered, That the following Standing Order be made, with effect from 27th November 2001:-

    'Reports concerning human rights.

    169A. In the case of a private bill originating in this House or brought from the House of Lords, a report from a minister of the Crown on the statement of opinion required by Standing Order 38 (2A) shall be presented to the House (by being deposited in the Private Bill Office) not later than the second sitting day after that on which the bill was read a first time.'.-(The Chairman of Ways and Means.)

3    Ninth Standing Committee on Delegated Legislation,-Mr Bowen Wells reported from the Ninth Standing Committee on Delegated Legislation the Financial Services Act 1986 (Extension of Scope of Act and Meaning of Collective Investment Scheme) Order 2001.

    Minutes of Proceedings of the Committee to lie upon the Table.

4    European Standing Committee B,-Mr George Stevenson reported from European Standing Committee B the following Resolution:

    That the Committee takes note of European Union Document No. 13119/00, a Commission Communication on a Common Asylum Procedure and Uniform Status for Persons Granted Asylum; and supports the Government's active participation in the debate on the Communication and the Government's intention to participate in measures which would lead to the establishment of a common European asylum system, without undermining the integrity of the UK's frontier control.

    Report, together with Resolution, to lie upon the Table.

5    Message from the Lords,-A Message was brought from the Lords, as follows:

    The Lords agree without Amendment to the Amendment made by this House to the Social Security Fraud Bill [Lords].

6    Banking (Inquiry) Bill,-Mr Christopher Leslie, supported by Mr Phil Hope, Mr Terry Rooney, Mr James Plaskitt, Ms Sally Keeble, Maria Eagle, Shona McIsaac and Ms Rosie Winterton presented a Bill to require the Financial Services Authority to carry out an inquiry into the operation of overdraft facilities provided by clearing banks and deposit-taking institutions; and for connected purposes: And the same was read the first time; and ordered to be read a second time on Friday 11th May and to be printed [Bill 91].

7    Bereavement Payments (Entitlement Conditions) (Amendment),-Ordered, That leave be given to bring in a Bill to amend the timescale within which payments may be made to bereaved persons: And that Mr Roger Gale, Mr Peter Bottomley, Mrs Helen Brinton, Mr Ian Bruce, Mr Nigel Jones, Mr Andrew Rowe, The Reverend Martin Smyth, Mr Ian Stewart, Mrs Ann Winterton and Sir Sydney Chapman do prepare and bring it in.

8    Bereavement Payments (Entitlement Conditions) (Amendment) Bill,-Mr Roger Gale accordingly presented a Bill to amend the timescale within which payments may be made to bereaved persons: And the same was read the first time; and ordered to be read a second time on Friday 11th May and to be printed [Bill 92].

9    Standing Committee on Regional Affairs,-A Motion was made, and the Question being put forthwith, pursuant to Standing Order No. 117, That-

    (1) the matter of raising the economic performance of the regions and tackling regional imbalances, being a matter relating to regional affairs in England, be referred to the Standing Committee on Regional Affairs;

    (2) the committee meet at half-past One o'clock on Thursday 10th May at Westminster to consider the matter referred to it under paragraph (1) above; and

    (3) the proceedings at that meeting be interrupted at Four o'clock-(Jim Dowd):-It was agreed to.

10    Regulatory Reform,-A Motion was made and the Question being proposed, That the following changes be made to the Standing Orders of the House-

    A. That Standing Order No. 141 (Deregulation Committee) be repealed and the following new Standing Order be made-

Deregulation and Regulatory Reform Committee

    (1) There shall be a select committee, called the Deregulation and Regulatory Reform Committee, to examine-

    (i) every document containing proposals laid before the House under section 3 of the Deregulation and Contracting Out Act 1994 (the 1994 Act) or under section 6 of the Regulatory Reform Act 2001 (the 2001 Act);

    (ii) every draft order proposed to be made under section 1 of the 1994 Act or section 1 of the 2001 Act; and

    (iii) every subordinate provisions order or draft of such an order made or proposed to be made under sections 1 and 4 of the 2001 Act.

    (2) The committee shall report to the House, in relation to every proposals document referred to in paragraph 1(i) of this order, either

    (a) that a draft order in the same terms as the proposals should be laid before the House; or

    (b) that the proposals should be amended before a draft order is laid before the House; or

    (c) that the order-making power should not be used in respect of the proposals.

    (3) The committee shall report to the House, in relation to every draft order referred to in paragraph 1(ii) of this order, its recommendation whether the draft order should be approved.

    (4) The committee may draw the special attention of the House to any subordinate provisions order or draft order referred to in paragraph 1(iii) of this order, and may report its opinion whether or not the order or draft order should be approved or, as the case may be, annulled.

    (5) The committee may report to the House on any matter arising from its consideration of the said proposals, draft orders or subordinate provisions orders.

    (6)(A) In its consideration of proposals the committee shall consider in each case whether the proposals-

    (a) appear to make an inappropriate use of delegated legislation;

    (b) remove or reduce a burden or the authorisation or requirement of a burden;

    (c) continue any necessary protection;

    (d) have been the subject of, and take appropriate account of, adequate consultation;

    (e) impose a charge on the public revenues or contain provisions requiring payments to be made to the Exchequer or any government department or to any local or public authority in consideration of any licence or consent or of any services to be rendered, or prescribe the amount of any such charge or payment;

    (f) purport to have retrospective effect;

    (g) give rise to doubts whether they are intra vires;

    (h) require elucidation, are not written in plain English or appear to be defectively drafted;

    (i) appear to be incompatible with any obligation resulting from membership of the European Union.

    (B) In the case of proposals presented under the 2001 Act, the committee shall also consider whether the proposals-

    (j) prevent any person from continuing to exercise any right or freedom which he might reasonably expect to continue to exercise;

    (k) satisfy the conditions of proportionality between burdens and benefits set out in sections 1 and 3 of the Act;

    (l) satisfy the test of desirability set out in section 3(2)(b) of the Act;

    (m) have been the subject of, and take appropriate account of, estimates of increases or reductions in costs or other benefits which may result from their implementation; or

    (n) include provisions to be designated in the draft order as subordinate provisions;

    and in the case of the latter consideration the committee shall report its opinion whether such a designation should be made, and to what parliamentary proceedings any subordinate provisions orders should be subject.

    (7) In its consideration of draft orders, the committee shall consider in each case all such matters set out in paragraph (6) of this order as are relevant and the extent to which the Minister concerned has had regard to any resolution or report of the Committee or to any other representations made during the period for parliamentary consideration.

    (8) In its consideration of any subordinate provisions order the committee shall in each case consider whether the special attention of the House should be drawn to it on any of the grounds on which (in accordance with paragraph 1(B) of Standing Order No. 151 (Statutory Instruments (Joint Committee)) the Select Committee on Statutory Instruments may draw the attention of the House to a statutory instrument; and if the committee is of the opinion that any such order or draft order should be annulled, or, as the case may be, should not be approved, they shall report that opinion to the House.

    (9) The committee shall consist of eighteen members.

    (10) The quorum of the committee shall be five.

    (11) Unless the House otherwise orders, each Member nominated to the committee shall continue to be a member of it for the remainder of the Parliament.

    (12) The committee shall have power-

    (a) to send for persons, papers and records, to sit notwithstanding any adjournment of the House, to adjourn from place to place within the United Kingdom, and to report from time to time;

    (b) to appoint specialist advisers either to supply information which is not readily available or to elucidate matters of complexity within the committee's order of reference;

    (c) to appoint a sub-committee, of which the quorum shall be two, which shall have power to send for persons, papers and records, to sit notwithstanding any adjournment of the House, and to adjourn from place to place within the United Kingdom;

    (d) to communicate its evidence and any other documents relating to matters of common interest to any committee appointed by this House and to any committee appointed by the Lords to examine deregulation and regulatory reform proposals and draft orders.

    (13) The committee and the sub-committee shall have leave to meet concurrently with any select committee appointed by the Lords to examine deregulation and regulatory reform proposals and draft orders and any sub-committee thereof.

    (14) The committee and the sub-committee shall have the assistance of the Counsel to the Speaker and, if their Lordships think fit, the Counsel to the Lord Chairman of Committees.

    (15) The committee and the sub-committee shall have power to invite Members of the House who are not members of the committee to attend meetings at which witnesses are being examined and such Members may, at the discretion of the chairman, ask questions of those witnesses; but no Member not being of the committee shall otherwise take part in the proceedings of the committee or sub-committee, or be counted in the quorum.

    (16) It shall be an instruction to the committee that before reporting either-

    (a) that any proposal should be amended before the draft order is laid before the House, or

    (b) that the order-making power should not be used in respect of any proposal, or

    (c) that any draft order should not be approved,

    it shall afford to any government department concerned an opportunity of furnishing orally or in writing to it or to the sub-committee appointed by it such explanations as the department think fit.

    (17) It shall be an instruction to the committee that it report on every draft order (not being a subordinate provisions order) not more than fifteen sitting days after the draft order was laid before the House, indicating in the case of draft orders which it recommends should be approved whether its recommendation was agreed without a division.

    B. That the following amendments be made to Standing Order No. 18 (Consideration of draft deregulation orders)-

    (1) Title, after 'deregulation', insert 'etc.'.

    (2) Line 1, after 'Deregulation', insert 'and Regulatory Reform'.

    (3) Line 3, after 'Deregulation', insert 'and Regulatory Reform'.

    (4) Line 5, after '1994', insert 'or under section 1 of the Regulatory Reform Act 2001'.

    C. That the following amendment be made to Standing Order No. 98 (Scottish Grand Committee (delegated legislation)-

    Line 15, after 'order', insert 'or regulatory reform order'.

    D. That the following amendment be made to Standing Order No. 115 (Northern Ireland Grand Committee (delegated legislation))-

    Line 15, after 'order', insert 'or regulatory reform order'.

    E. That the following amendment be made to Standing Order No. 118 (Standing committees on delegated legislation))-

    Line 14, after 'order', insert 'or regulatory reform order'.

    F. That the following amendment be made to Standing Order No. 151 (Statutory Instruments (Joint Committee))-

    Line 25, after '1994', insert 'or under section 1 of the Regulatory Reform Act 2001, or any subordinate provisions order made or draft proposed to be made under that Act'.

    G. That the following amendment be made to Standing Order No. 152 (Select committees related to government departments)-

    Line 33, after 'Deregulation', insert 'and Regulatory Reform'.-(Mr Graham Stringer.)

    An Amendment (a) was proposed to the Question, in line 70, to leave out the word 'five' and to insert the word 'seven' instead thereof.-(Mr Eric Forth.)

    Question, That the Amendment be made, put and negatived.

    And the Main Question being put:-it was agreed to.

11    Working Group on Provision for Former Members,-Ordered, That this House is aware that many Members who leave the House, whether by retirement or otherwise, would welcome the opportunity to remain in contact with each other; believes also that former Members might benefit from being in touch with sources of personal advice and assistance with difficulties arising once they have left the House; and suggests that a small informal group be set up to consider how these issues might be addressed, to report to the Speaker and the Leader of the House.-(Margaret Beckett.)

12    City of London (Ward Elections) Bill,-The House, according to Order, proceeded further to consider the City of London (Ward Elections) Bill, as amended by the Chairman of Ways and Means.

    Amendment (No. 7) proposed, in page 1, line 18, at the end, to insert the words-

    ' "business electoral college" means a body comprising voters appointed under section 3(1)(c) with responsibility for electing the business voters entitled to vote in ward elections.'-(Mr John McDonnell.)

    Mr Peter Brooke rose in his place and claimed to move, That the Question be now proposed.

    And the Question being put, That the Question be now proposed;

    The House divided.

      Tellers for the Ayes, Mrs Jacqui Lait, Mr Peter Bottomley: 99.

      Tellers for the Noes, Mr Andrew Dismore, Mr John McDonnell: 36.

    Whereupon the Deputy Speaker declared that the Question was not decided in the Affirmative because it was not supported by the majority prescribed by Standing Order No. 37 (Majority for closure or for proposal of question).

    Mr Andrew Dismore moved, That the House sit in private.

    The Deputy Speaker put the Question forthwith, pursuant to Standing Order No. 163 (Motions to sit in public).

    The House divided.

      Tellers for the Ayes, Mr Andrew Dismore, Mr Jeremy Corbyn: 2.

      Tellers for the Noes, Mr Dennis Skinner, Mr Harry Barnes: 109.

    So the Question was negatived.

    Mr Peter Brooke rose in his place and claimed to move, That the Question be now proposed.

    And the Question being put, That the Question be now proposed;

    The House divided.

      Tellers for the Ayes, Mrs Jacqui Lait, Mr Peter Bottomley: 91.

      Tellers for the Noes, Mr Jeremy Corbyn, Mr Andrew Dismore: 34.

    Whereupon the Deputy Speaker declared that the Question was not decided in the Affirmative because it was not supported by the majority prescribed by Standing Order No. 37 (Majority for closure or for proposal of question).

    And it being after Seven o'clock, further consideration of the Bill stood adjourned.

    Ordered, That the Bill be further considered on Thursday 10th May.

13    Public Petitions,-A Public Petition from Health workers in Dorset and others for the cost of living supplement for National Health Service employees to be paid to those working in Dorset was presented and read; and ordered to lie upon the Table and to be printed.

14    Public Petitions,-A Public Petition from residents of North Norfolk and others for payment of pensions and benefit entitlements through sub-Post Offices was presented; and ordered to lie upon the Table and to be printed.

15    Adjournment,-Resolved, That this House do now adjourn.-(Mr Ian Pearson.)

    And accordingly the House, having continued to sit till twenty-four minutes to Eleven o'clock, adjourned till to-morrow.

[Adjourned at 10.36 p.m.

Michael J. Martin
Speaker


Mr Speaker will take the Chair at half-past Eleven o'clock.


    APPENDIX I

Papers presented or laid upon the Table:

Papers subject to Negative Resolution:

    1    Animals,-The BSE Monitoring (England) Regulations 2001(S.I., 2001, No. 1644), dated 1st May 2001 [by Act] [Mr Nicholas Brown].

    2    Road Traffic,-Motor Cycles Etc. (EC Type Approval) (Amendment) (No. 2) Regulations 2001 (S.I., 2001, No. 1547), dated 23rd April 2001 [by Act] [Mr Secretary Prescott].

    3    Sea Fisheries,-Sea Fishing (Enforcement of Community Quota and Third Country Fishing Measures) Order 2001 (S.I., 2001, No. 1631), dated 30th April 2001 [by Act] [Mr Nicholas Brown].

Other Papers:

    4    Financial Reporting to Parliament,-Departmental Report 2001: The Government's Expenditure Plans for 2001-02 to 2003-04 and Main Estimates for 2001-02 for the Department of Health [by Command] [Cm. 5103] [Mr Secretary Milburn].

    5    Health,-Departmental Minute, dated 2nd May 2001, concerning a contingent liability consequent upon clinical trials to be undertaken by the National Blood Authority [by Command] [Mr Secretary Milburn].

    6    Overseas Pensions,-The Indian Family Pensions (Transferred) (United Kingdom) (Amendment) Scheme 2001, dated 26th April 2001[by Act] [Secretary Clare Short].

    7    Reserve Forces,-Reserve Forces (Attributable Benefits Etc) Regulations 2001, dated 26th April 2001 [by Act] [Mr Secretary Hoon].

    8    Severn Bridges,-Accounts prepared pursuant to section 28(1)(b) of the Severn Bridges Act 1992 for 1998-99 and 1999-2000, with the Reports of the Comptroller and Auditor General thereon [by Act]; to be printed [Nos. 453 and 454] [Clerk of the House].

    9    Treaty Series (No. 137, 2000),-Index to Treaty Series 2000 [Cm. 5137] [Mr Secretary Cook].

APPENDIX II

Standing Committees

    1    Rating (Former Agricultural Premises and Rural Shops) Bill:

    (1) The Speaker has allocated the Bill to Standing Committee B, and has appointed Mr Joe Benton and Mrs Ray Michie Chairmen; and

    (2) the Committee of Selection has nominated sixteen Members to serve on the Committee, viz.: Mr Robert Ainsworth, Hilary Armstrong, Mr David Borrow, Mr Ian Cawsey, Mr Brian Cotter, Mr David Drew, Mr Huw Edwards, Mr Christopher Fraser, Mr James Gray, Mr Damian Green, Mr David Heath, Mr Kevin Hughes, Ms Sally Keeble, Miss Anne McIntosh, Mrs Diana Organ and Mr Peter Temple-Morris.

    2    Community Legal Service (Funding) (Counsel in Family Proceedings) Order 2001 (S.I., 2001, No. 1077):

    (1) The Speaker has allocated the Order to the First Standing Committee on Delegated Legislation, and has appointed Mr Nicholas Winterton Chairman; and

    (2) the Committee of Selection has nominated sixteen Members to serve on the Committee, viz.: Mr John Burnett, Mr David Chidgey, Mr Paul Clark, Mr Michael Connarty, Mr Bill Etherington, Mr Nigel Griffiths, Mr Nick Hawkins, Ms Jenny Jones, Jane Kennedy, Mr Piara S. Khabra, Mrs Anne McGuire, Miss Anne McIntosh, Dr Nick Palmer, Mr Owen Paterson, Mr Laurence Robertson and Mr Paul Stinchcombe.

    3    Education (Student Support) Regulations 2001 (S.I., 2001, No. 951), the Education Standards Fund (England) (Amendment) Regulations 2001 (S.I., 2001, No. 826) and the Financing of Maintained Schools (England) (Amendment) Regulations 2001 (S.I., 2001, No. 907),-The Committee of Selection has discharged Mr Frank Dobson, Mr Patrick Nicholls and Mr Andrew Robathan from the Fourth Standing Committee on Delegated Legislation (nominated in respect of the Regulations); and nominated in substitution Estelle Morris, Mr Richard Shepherd and Sir Teddy Taylor.

European Standing Committees

    4    European Union Documents Nos. 7262/01, 7263/01, 7377/01 and 7378/01, all relating to the Commission Green Paper on the future of the Common Fisheries Policy, have been referred to European Standing Committee A.

APPENDIX III

Reports from Select Committees

    1    Agriculture,-(1) Ninth Special Report from the Agriculture Committee [Government Response to the Sixth Report from the Committee, on The UK Pig Industry]; to be printed [No. 456];

    (2) Minutes of Evidence taken before the Committee [Foot and Mouth Disease]; to be printed [No. 363-v]; and

    (3) Memoranda laid before the Committee [Foot and Mouth Disease; Sea Fishing]

    [Mr David Curry].

    2    Defence,-(1) Eighth Report from the Committee [The MoD's Annual Reporting Cycle 2000-2001] together with the Appendices to the Minutes of Evidence taken before the Committee; to be printed with the Minutes of Proceedings of the Committee relating to the Report [No.144];

    (2) Fourth Special Report from the Committee [Government Observations on the Committee's Second Report, Session 2000-01: The Strategic Defence Review: Policy for People]; to be printed [No. 462]; and

    (3) Minutes of Evidence taken before the Committee [Annual Major Procurement Projects]; to be printed [No. 463-i ]

    [Mr Bruce George].

    3    Education and Employment,-(1) Minutes of Evidence taken before the Education Sub-committee of the Education and Employment Committee [Early Years: Follow-up], together with Appendices; to be printed [No. 438-ii] [Mr Barry Sheerman]; and

    (2) Minutes of Evidence taken before the Employment Sub-committee of the Education and Employment Committee [Work-Life Balance]; to be printed [No. 461-i] [Mr Derek Foster].

    4    Environment, Transport and Regional Affairs,-Eleventh Report from the Environment, Transport and Regional Affairs Committee [Walking in Towns and Cities], with the Appendices to the Minutes of Evidence taken before the Committee; to be printed, with the Minutes of Proceedings of the Committee relating to the Report [No. 167-I and II] [Mr Andrew F. Bennett]

    5    European Scrutiny,-Thirteenth Report from the European Scrutiny Committee; to be printed, with the Minutes of Proceedings of the Committee relating to the Report [No. 28-xiii] [Mr Michael Connarty].

    6    Northern Ireland Affairs,-(1) Fourth Report from the Northern Ireland Affairs Committee [Legal Aid in Northern Ireland], together with Appendices to the Minutes of Evidence taken before the Committee; to be printed, with the Minutes of Proceedings of the Committee relating to the Report [No. 444]; and

    (2) Fifth Report from the Committee [Miscellaneous Financial Matters and the Government's Response to the Committee's Third Report, Session 1999-2000], together with Appendices to the Minutes of Evidence taken before the Committee; to be printed, with the Minutes of Proceedings of the Committee relating to the Report [No. 458]

    [Mr Peter Brooke].

    7    Public Accounts,-Minutes of Evidence taken before the Committee of Public Accounts [Regulating housing associations' management of financial risk]; to be printed [No. 460-i] [Mr David Davis].

    8    Public Administration,-(1) Minutes of Evidence taken before the Select Committee on Public Administration [The Annual Report of the Parliamentary Ombudsman for 1999-2000]; to be printed [No. 62-ii]; and

    (2) Memoranda laid before the Committee [Use of the Knowledge Network: Guidance to Special Advisors during an Election Period]

    [Tony Wright].

    9    Science and Technology,-(1) Third Special Report from the Science and Technology Committee [Responses from the Government and from Corus plc to the Committee's Second Report, on Corus plc - Research and Development]; to be printed [No. 421]; and

    (2) Minutes of Evidence taken before the Committee [The Work of the Chief Scientific Adviser]; to be printed [No. 420-i]

    [Dr Michael Clark].

    10    Social Security,-Minutes of Evidence taken before the Social Security Committee [Departmental Report]; to be printed [No. 457-i] [Mr Archy Kirkwood].

    11    Trade and Industry,-(1) Fourth Special Report from the Trade and Industry Committee [Government's Response to the Committee's Third Report, on Vehicle Manufacturing in the UK]; to be printed [No. 455]; and

    (2) Minutes of Evidence taken before the Committee [The Work of the Small Business Service]; to be printed [No. 464]

    [Mr Martin O'Neill].

    12    Treasury,-Minutes of Evidence taken before the Treasury Committee [The Council of Economic and Finance Ministers (ECOFIN)]; to be printed [No. 459-i] [Mr Giles Radice].

    13    Welsh Affairs,-Minutes of Evidence taken before the Welsh Affairs Committee [Job Losses in the Steel Industry in Wales]; to be printed [No. 295-ii] [Mr Martyn Jones].

[W.H., No. 45]

Minutes of Proceedings of the Sitting in Westminster Hall

[pursuant to the Order of 20th November 2000]

The sitting commenced at half-past Nine o'clock.

    Adjournment,-A Motion was made, and the Question being proposed, That the sitting be now adjourned-(Mr Don Touhig);

    And it being Two o'clock, the sitting was adjourned without Question put, till to-morrow.

[Adjourned at 2 p.m.

Sir Alan Haselhurst

Deputy Speaker



 
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